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Drum Machines

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(@anonymous)
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Joined: 17 years ago
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Topic starter  

I have a couple questions about drum machines. What are they for? Are they just for keeping rhythm?

I was wondering because there has been talk about getting a band together but no one knows a drummer and I was told to use a drum machine instead.


   
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(@kingpatzer)
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Joined: 19 years ago
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Drum machines range from the very simple to the very complex.

At base, they are just fancy metronomes. You set a drum pattern, a tempo, and off it goes.

As machines go up in price, the features expand. You can start doing drum fills, having midi files drive the drumming, do multiple tempos, have a wider range of sounds, etc.

While you can generally get a satisfactory result with synthetic drums (either machines, or software plug-ins) in a recording session, they are a little too limited for real use in a live band. You can get by with one, but you'll know you're missing something.

The biggest advantage of drum machines -- that they keep a constant tempo -- is also their biggest drawback in a live setting. Generally in live music tempo shifts slightly when the "exciting" parts of the song come up. A band that is regarded as tight isn't tight because it keeps the same tempo, but because it shifts tempo slightly together. Machines just can't do that.

They also can't give you an impomptu drum roll when you tell a joke :)

While if you don't have a drummer, they're a reasonable substitute, they aren't a replacement.

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
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(@pkrider)
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Drum machines are great! They drink less beer, always show up on time, are easy to control the volume, and never miss a beat once programmed :). Although I say these things in jest, there is alot of truth here too. I used to own an Alesis SR16 which is a great inexpensive unit and easy to program. I graduated to a Boss DR 550 because with the boss I have a 4 track sequencer and can add a bass line, synth, and keys. also, the Boss DR 550 has the notes laid out like a guitar neck and is easy to program without knowing anything but the neck and chords of a guitar. I play the drum tracks thru my PA, which is a Peavy 200 Watt 6 channel head with 2 way 15" speakers (this PA can easily handle any small club). I used to play the drum machinie thru my guitar amp's 2nd channel, but by moving it to the PA I get better seperation and a signifigantly better sound. Also, the drum machine allows me to practice at lower volumes! A live drummer usually bangs the skins so hard you need to crank the guitars up as to not get buried by the drummer (This makes for some ear ringing practice your neighbors will love). Even if you wind up working with a live drummer a drum machine can be a valuable tool.

Hope this helps,

PK

PS
I respectfully disagree with the above comment that a machine cant replace a live drummer... they can and often do. Also, regarding tempo shifts... I cringe at that comment. Many bands attach a glorified metronome into the earpiece of the drummer to avoid tempo shifts (sometimes called a clicker). Anyhow, just my $.02


   
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(@greybeard)
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They also can't give you an impomptu drum roll when you tell a joke
Whilst made in jest, he's very close to one home truth about drummers - they're flexible. A good group will build a song on "feel", sometimes a solo will go on for a few extra bars, a chorus will be repeated because the whole audience is doing it, etc.. A drummer, like the rest of the group, adjusts in real time. If the group is going down well, they may even throw in a bass or drum solo.
Try getting a drum machine to do anything like that.

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 cnev
(@cnev)
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I would tend to agree with King and Greybeard you'd be limited with a drum machine in a live situation but I think they can work well for use in practice. Plus I personally have never heard a drum machine that sounds the same as a live drummer.

If you were doing an acoustic one man show then maybe you could get away with a drum machine for a backing track but that's about it.

"It's all about stickin it to the man!"
It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!


   
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(@off-he-goes)
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I'm going echo what Greybeard and king are saying also. They do work well for recordings, but they lack in live shows. If you guys wanted to put together a demo, then I'd say go right for it, but I wouldn't use one for a live show. I've seen it done a fair bit, and it's really not that great.

Vacate is the word...Vengance has no place on me or her...Cannot find a comfort in this world.


   
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(@pkrider)
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I guess my point is, Don't let the lack of a drummer prevent you from forming a band! It's all well and good if you have the drummer at hand, but you can make alot of progress towards your goal of playing live without having a drummer. Once you get some gigs, especially if they pay, it will be much easier to get the drummer. You can work up an entire set on the machine, then easily work the real drummer in. But, if forming a band hinges on finding a drummer I say get the machine first, then get the drummer once you get your groove going....

PK


   
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(@dogbite)
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I have a Dr Rythm by Boss.
I can use the factory settings, which are many, to give me beats when I jam for fun or practice.
on this machine (er...plastic box) I can use the user presets and combine them into a set piece.

that way if I dont change the song I can start and finish on a programmed beat.

I have seen solo players hook everything up together somehow.

so when they start strumming the drums kick in. pretty amazing.

there is nothing better IMO than a live drummer.

if you are good understanding user manuals that come with these electronic devices then go for it.

I can barely make sense of manuals. still, I was able to use the Boss drum machine pretty well.

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=644552
http://www.soundclick.com/couleerockinvaders


   
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(@rocker)
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dogbite,

what happened bro? there good for demo's, but i would not show up live with out a drummer, you will look foolish.

even god loves rock-n-roll


   
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 geoo
(@geoo)
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I have a Dr Rythm by Boss.
I have a Dr Rythm by Boss.
I have a Dr Rythm by Boss.
I have a Dr Rythm by Boss.
I have a Dr Rythm by Boss.

Thinking about OWA's question and it just makes me wonder what Dogbite is using. :shock: LOL

I have seen some really good acts just use a drum machine but it wasnt anywhere near as good as live drummer. But I dont see why you couldnt get away with using one while you are looking for a drummer.

Geoo

“The hardest thing in life is to know which bridge to cross and which to burn” - David Russell (Scottish classical Guitarist. b.1942)


   
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(@dogbite)
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Joined: 19 years ago
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whoa dudes!!!!!
I didnt post all those.
Ill delete them.

and....

I have never used the drum machine for a gig.
only for home jammin and if I need a it for praticing (which is rare to never).

there is nothing inherently wrong with a machine.
it cannot beat a live drummer. oops a pun.

This was a step up from the Casio keyboard with drum beats.
remember those?

when my best jam buddy drops in we usually put on some beat producing machine. it helps fill out the room and gives us a beat. another thing it can do for us is to challenge our playing.
we intentionally put on some latin beat at a good tempo and then jam an old 60's Rolling Stones tune.
good fun.

it's hilarious when we end up cranking louder than the machine; we get off beat too. when we finish we can hear the pathetic beat through our ringing ears.

as I said, I saw a player use one very tastefully for a solo gig.

but no .not me. I prefer live drummers.

I could never do that.

:)

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=644552
http://www.soundclick.com/couleerockinvaders


   
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(@kingpatzer)
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Posts: 2171
 

I think everyone here agrees, though, that while a live drummer is far superior to a drum machine, using a drum machine is superior to not playing in a band ;)

Although, there are plenty of cool things you can do without a drummer at all (listen to Django!) Most of today's music pretty well demands one.

Now taking things (slightly) off topic:

Also, regarding tempo shifts... I cringe at that comment. Many bands attach a glorified metronome into the earpiece of the drummer to avoid tempo shifts (sometimes called a clicker). Anyhow, just my $.02

I play a lot of jazz. Jazz attracts a lot of very good dancers -- Lindy Hoppers and the like. The dancers will goad the band to up the tempo in the middle of the song . . . and god help the band that doesn't respond . . . a good band can tempo shift together. It's one of the defining characteriscs of a good band -- they can follow each other over the abyss :)

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
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(@gnease)
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... but one only has to feed a drum machine batteries -- drummers, OTOH ...

There are always counter examples: The "Echo" of Echo and the Bunnymen is (or once was) a drum machine.

-=tension & release=-


   
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(@dogbite)
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... but one only has to feed a drum machine batteries -- drummers, OTOH ...

There are always counter examples: The "Echo" of Echo and the Bunnymen is (or once was) a drum machine.

alot (maybe too much) of that 80's music was machine driven.

I dont know what's worse, the bad tenors or fake drums.

http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pagemusic.cfm?bandID=644552
http://www.soundclick.com/couleerockinvaders


   
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(@anonymous)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 8184
Topic starter  

Wow, thank you for all the input.

There is no band yet, just talk about one. But I'm sure this well help us come to a decision.


   
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