Getting fed up :-(

too many people put their playing in the context of time. And just think, 2 years @ 20 min. a day vs 2 years @ 6 hours a day makes a difference. I practice (almost) every day for about 2-3 hours, and I play more than that, and gig steadily. When I wasn't so busy, my full time with the guitar during the day was at least 10-12 hours, sometimes more. I once stayed up for 3 days doing nothing but playing guitar (which would've went longer, but I ran outta cofee)

It all depends on what you WANT to do. If you want to become phenominal, you gotta put in the time. If you're just doing it for fun, then keep it in context. The imortant thing to remember when learning to play (if you want to be the best you can be) is to practice correctly. check out guitarprincipals.com for that. As for exercises, there out there. Millions of them, all great in their own way.

keep working at it, and most importantly do what you really want.

best of luck.

I too had trouble with the financial part of lessons. $20 for a half hour was just too much for me. I got in on some community group lessons that cost $75 for 10. I'm sure that they are not as good as one on one but I'm learning a lot.

Well, with me it wasn't a "I've gotta get good quick" thing at all. I just enjoyed playing. I would still play that much but it drives everybody in the house crazy. I have never had to force myself to practice. I love it.

Well, I always want to get good quickly. And that is exactly what happened to me (and everyone else!) when I started with the guitar. No matter what everyone else says, I think it is amazing I can play the chords along to pretty much every album I have, and play a fair ammount of solo's too, whereas I had no clue how many strings a guitar had 15 months or so ago. So what if Hendrix can play better then I can. I suck far less then I did last year, and I'll suck even less next year . This week I learned how to cleanly switch between a A7 and E9. Nick, David, Joe, Wes and tons of others here learned that stuff years ago. And you know what? Knowing that doesn't even make me remotely less happy: I learned something I couldn't do before!

Just sit back and enjoy yourself. Feeling stuck? Try to learn a new chord, scale, or bit of theory. Might seem trivial, but if you do this every week you'll discover you've actually learn a lot in a year. Don't try to be better then anyone else, try to be better then you were the day before.

ok grab a book and lock ur self in a room for bout 3 to 4 hours 1.5 hours isnt enough i practice more then that in a day...do that and u will se improvment

ok grab a book and lock ur self in a room for bout 3 to 4 hours 1.5 hours isnt enough i practice more then that in a day...do that and u will se improvment

You know, that is total nonsense. You can practice for 30 minutes a day and see improvement. And what might be even worse to hear: one day you'll probably wake up next to your girlfriend/wife, who expects you to have a job. Which means you can't even spend 4 hours, even if you wanted to. Suprisingly, even people with a family to support, a job to maintain and a mortage to pay off can pick up a guitar and learn how to play. Without becoming a socially-isolated hermit.

"1.5 hours a day not enough." Give me break...

Well put Arjen. I'm in the job, kids, mortgage, freinds, maintaining the home and hobbies boat. I manage to get in 1 - 1 1/2 hours four or five days a week now, if I'm really lucky. Am I better than I was, darn straight, am I as good as I want to be, never will be. In the grand scheme of things though I enjoy guitar, and I have no illusions about becoming an international guitar God.

Curlycurtain,

Put in as much time as you have. If your in college this probably isn't a lot, but keep at it. When you practice for your thirty minutes concentrate on what you are doing exclusively, you will improve. There is no level you "should" be at. Remember that guitar is only part of your life, treat it as such, and don't lose sight of the enjoyment you can get from it. It's not a race, nor is it, for most, the end all an be all. Do what you can now, and your day when you can do more will come. Make it work for you. Ignore the "you should be able to xxxxx by now" comments, or the "you need to lock yourself away for x hours per day to improve" remarks. Do the best you can now and stick with something you enjoy. Limited practice time may make your progress slower, but skill may still come. Concentrate and enjoy yourself.

Is there something wrong with being a socially isolated hermit? :lol:

Just a thought here. You say you are going to college. My guess is you aren't the only one there that plays or is learning to play. Take atvantage of the situation. Ask around, you'd be surprised how many would be willing to help you out for a small fee of some type. Also try to find someone who is also learning and set up some time to practice/play together. Playing with others is a great asset.

Is there something wrong with being a socially isolated hermit? :lol:

:lol: ROFLMAO! :lol:

just in terms of time -

Psychological studies on experts have found that it takes approx 10,000 to 20,000 hours of commited effort to attain expert level at a given domain. Competency is estimated at approx 3,000 hours.

That estimate applied to guitar practice then would require ten hours a day of practice for a year to reach competency. Or three years of the same to reach the lower levels of expert.

Just for fun- if one practiced two hours a day, it would then take thirteen years to attain 10,000 hours.

I realize most people don't think this way about their commitment. However, it does help to explain why it often requires a child to begin early and practice seriously 3-4 hours a day for years at their instrument before they "appear" as a teen and demonstrate considerable proficiency.

just food for thought.

Just thought I'd also share one of my piano teacher's favourite quotes:
Don't "play", "understand".

By this he meant that study-time for a instrument requires thought, effort and concentration if you want to learn new material. Just like in maths, physics, foreign languages, track-and-field, ballet...

Sitting in front of the Tv carelessly strumming your guitar while you watch Simpson reruns won't lead to any improvement. You're just playing what you already know. More often than not, playing it badly. ;)

Put in another way - 30 minutes of careful study can sometimes be much more efficient than 4 hours of aimless practice.

Perhaps you could start by optimizing your practice sessions, to have it be as instructive and fruitful as possible.

Then make it a point of learning something new once a (insert objective here), to force you to study. Learning new material will also be motivational, since you will have a gauge to track your evolution.

To me, there's at least three levels of music performance:

There's the physical level - the 'chops'. You've got to put in some time to get this down, although I find different people need very different amounts of time on the same thing. For me, vibrato was harder to learn than most techniques... my students seem to pick it up faster than I did, but other things were easier, like barre chords - as I recall, I had clean tone after just a few days of practice.

Then there's the mental level, which is a sort of triangle between the music on the page, the sound in your head, and the fingers on the instrument. Getting to a point where those three elements are the same (or very close to the same) takes time, but it doesn't always need to be time with a guitar in your hands.

Then there's the really elusive level, a sort of metaphysical one, where music is a medium of communication. It's like learning any foreign language - you learn words, sentences, all that... but it doesn't make you fluent. Being able to think in the language makes you fluent, and being fluent in music makes a musician.

In a way they're all just different facets of the same thing, and you can't get there without practice. I reached a fairly competent level in about the first two years of playing (two years of 5+ hours a day), which sort of fits with the 3,000 hour figure Plutarch mentioned. Over the past 30 years I've played anywhere from 1-12 hours a day, and I seem to need 1-1/2 to 2 hours a day to maintain fluency.... but that's just me; some folks I know can play well with just a few hours a month (and I'm envious!), while others practice lots more than I do and can't keep up.

I think a person's performance is a better reflection of how well they practice than how long they do it.

For me, vibrato was harder to learn than most techniques...

I can absolutely relate to that. I STILL have a problem with vibrato. I watch other players and try to emulate what they're doing, but, for some unknown reason, I just CANNOT get it. I don't know if it's actually a physical limitation or a mental one. People tell me "just start waggling". Waggle how? Waggle just my finger? Waggle my entire hand? My entire wrist? Do I keep my thumb on the back of the neck or do I remove it entirely and concentrate on my waggling finger? And, I know that everyone who is offering me advice is offering it in good faith, they're telling me what they do and the various different ways to do it, and I've tried it all, but I just haven't hit upon the one thing that is going to break through my block and allow me to do it. What worked for you?

I think a person's performance is a better reflection of how well they practice than how long they do it.

I think you're absolutely right. I know some people who have played for years and years longer than I have, and they aren't much further along than I am. I'm not saying that I'm a better player, but I AM saying that I do believe that I am progressing at a faster rate than they are. I just see that I practice religiously every single day and they might go days or even weeks between practices and then it's only going to be songs that get practiced. They don't practice scales, chord progressions, freestyle improvisations, etc... they just pick up the guitar and start playing "Dead Flowers" or something and then they complain about their lack of progress or "being stuck in a rut". But, IMHO, it's a rut that they dug and it's up to them to fill it in.