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dont feel like dancing (sissor sisters)


(@almann1979)
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Joined: 14 years ago
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Topic starter  

In the first interlude of this song the chord sequence alternates between G and C chords - yet the solo over the top begins on an A#. unless i have the backing chords completely wrong i do not understand where this note fits in and how it can sound fine as it is missing in both the c major and g major scales?
can anybody shed any light on this for me - its driving me nuts!!!
in the second interlude the chord sequence is Bm F#m Am and G, breaking them down i get

Bm = b, d, f#
Am = A c e
F#m = f#, A C#
G = G b d

i cannot find out which key this fits into - i have used http://www.chordsandscales.co.uk/finder/ but all i get are scales like d japanese????? (eh?).

how would you go about making a solo for this chord progression.

i have got the tab so i could just learn it, and i will, but i NEED TO KNOW how it was put together and from which scale or i might just start to cry!!

any ideas of how you would put a solo to the above chord progression, or where the A# has come over the G and C chords??

"I like to play that guitar. I have to stare at it while I'm playing it because I'm not very good at playing it."
Noel Gallagher (who took the words right out of my mouth)


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(@fretsource)
Prominent Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 974
 

I don't know the song but here are some general points that might be of interest.

You can have ANY note in a solo. If it doesn't belongs to the major or minor scale of whatever the key happens to be, then it may be considered a chromatic alteration of a scale note, e.g., F# in the key of C. It can also be the case that a particular song is in a mode other than major or minor. Chromatically altered notes are very common and desirable, and music would be far less interesting without them
A common chromatic alteration is heard when guitarists use the pentatonic minor scale to solo over a song in a major key. So in G major you'd solo with notes of G pentatonic minor (G Bb C D F). There you have exactly the note/chord you were asking about i.e., Bb (A#) over the G chord.

As for the other part, you want to know the key. Which, if any, of those chords sounds like the key or 'home' chord? Or which one could you end on and make it sound complete and finished? That's the real test of a key - the key note/chord or tonal centre. With those chords you posted, the chances are that the key is G. F# minor doesn't fit the scale of G major as it contains the note C#, but that doesn't mean that it can't still be in the key of G. C# is just a chromatic alteration of C natural which is already present in the A minor chord.

Last but not least, a lot of music is written without any regard for the key. The song writer may not even know what a key is or what notes it contains but just choose chords that sound exactly right for that song. You'll often find chords that are there simply because they sound good, interesting, unusual, whatever. They don't always have to fit a scale or key, as that would be far too restricting.


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(@almann1979)
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Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 1283
Topic starter  

thanks very much for the detailed answer. At work i teach science and (not having much of an arty side to me) i try to box my music up into some failsafe logic which will always tell me the key or notes i need to be using in any situation. Im beginning to realise i cant do that, and if i want to progress i have got to rely on my (tone deaf) ear a little more.

by the way, it was a very interesting point you made about using the minor pentatoinc scale over a major key - i would love to learn some examples of this. are there any famous songs which have this so i can have a lok at them. Also, is it common to do this in reverse i.e use a major pentatonic over a minor key??

"I like to play that guitar. I have to stare at it while I'm playing it because I'm not very good at playing it."
Noel Gallagher (who took the words right out of my mouth)


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(@noteboat)
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Joined: 19 years ago
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Most blues/rock tunes use the pentatonic minor over a major chord progression. But over a minor chord progression you can't do the opposite - the tones that clash with the chords end up in the wrong place.

When you start improvising using the pentatonic scale, your safest bets are:

minor key chord progression - minor pentatonic in the same key (you'll get a "jazzy" sound)
major key chord progression - minor pentatonic in the same key (for a "bluesy" sound) or major pentatonic in the same key (for a "country" type sound)

Guitar teacher offering lessons in Plainfield IL


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(@almann1979)
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Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 1283
Topic starter  

great tips thanks!!

one last question. how will the starting point affect the sound? Say i use the A minor pentatonic over something in A major for a bluesey sound - will the sound be different if i play the scale around the 12th fret as oppossed to the 5th??

"I like to play that guitar. I have to stare at it while I'm playing it because I'm not very good at playing it."
Noel Gallagher (who took the words right out of my mouth)


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(@fretsource)
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Joined: 16 years ago
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great tips thanks!!

one last question. how will the starting point affect the sound? Say i use the A minor pentatonic over something in A major for a bluesey sound - will the sound be different if i play the scale around the 12th fret as oppossed to the 5th??

If I understand your question correctly, the only difference will be that the higher position gives you access to higher pitched notes of the scale, unreachable from the 5th position. And the 5th position lets you reach lower notes. Most of the notes will be reachable in either position but they will be on different strings, which gives you a subtle difference of tone.

Here's an example I found on Youtube for you of notes of the A minor pentatonic scale being played over a 12 bar blues in A. Notice that, even though the point of the video is to demonstrate the use of the pentatonic minor, the guitarist can't resist going outside it on occasion, as he admits himself.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=h86Ume4qE24


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(@almann1979)
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Joined: 14 years ago
Posts: 1283
Topic starter  

thanks fretsource. at this point id like to give a big thumbs up to the moderators of this forum. there is such a great nucleus of regular contributers and such a lack of the idiots you find on other forums who would fill this site with rubbsh. either the moderators work very hard to keep this forum so informative or this site is the best kept secret on the internet!

anyway, final question (again) - i have had a go over a backing track in c major, and for some reason using the c minor pentatonic scale i dont get a bluesey sound, just a rubbish one which doesnt fit.
The backing track can be found on the hear here forum on the jam i hosted called blues jam in Am (although it is actually in C major, which i now know). is there any reason using the chord progression on this track the c minor pentatonic wont work?? or is it just my playing?? if the c minor pentatonic will work, why cant i make it work? what rules am i missing??

my part is last and i used the Am scale as a substitute for C major - but i would love to re-record it using the c minor pentatonic if i can get it to work for me.
p.s sorry to blast a million questions at once, and if you are too busy to listen to it i will understand.
cheers Al

"I like to play that guitar. I have to stare at it while I'm playing it because I'm not very good at playing it."
Noel Gallagher (who took the words right out of my mouth)


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(@fretsource)
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Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 974
 

is there any reason using the chord progression on this track the c minor pentatonic wont work?? or is it just my playing?? if the c minor pentatonic will work, why cant i make it work? what rules am i missing??

It does work. Dan T, the first guitarist (and maybe also one of the others) has used it to good effect. It can't work for him but not for you. Try jamming along with his solo to get a feel for it.


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