Modes: I'm losing my mind and need kind help!

Ah, I see what you meant.

The way I view them, the Locrian isn't part of the modal system pre 1600 - it's a theory construct, so it doesn't have to behave the way the others do. I've even read some things that indicate the ancient Greeks also had the same scale - also created as a theoretical construct (and if I recall right, its creation was credited to Sappho).

I kinda lump the Locrian in with other synthetic scales - since its purpose is to fill a "hole", that's pretty much all it is... a space-keeper of sorts.

Note -- here's my idea:

try simply using a long string of the same chord. 8 measures of "C," for example. Now, use chord substitutions and re-harmonization to make the harmonic backdrop vary, but avoid cadence all together. Push ol' Miles' idea of modal jazz to the wall!

I don't know that it would work, but it would push your harmony as far to the back as you can go without losing it completely. At the end, you can have the melody drop out and add a harmonic resolution after the end of the melody. Giving you a melodic composition in your chosen mode, with a cadence at the end after a melodic fade, providing resolution in the harmony.

Now there's a plan.

I would even take that one step further in the Miles direction by using mostly tonally ambiguous chords. ie still use the subs but construct them with fourths and 2s instead of 3rds 5ths and sevenths, so no real defined harmony is shining through whatsoever (that is, you still know the chord is a C, but C what?) That way the tonality would be completely defined by the melody.

Awesome idea King.

I've actually tried it with both tertian and quartal harmonies... and I've no doubt I could do something along the Miles line.

But the problem is resolution - if I actually try resolving it to a simple minor third, it sounds like I'm in Phrygian. But I'll keep plugging away for a bit :)

I'm just playing around, but: Bb up to Eb down to Db up to Eb down to C gives me a sense of resolution. It's not strong, but I can see ending a tune that way either after or before the harmonic resolution, and the audience would, I think, except it.

You could even do it with a partial chord in the back ground: say, C-Eb-Ab triad moving to an Eb-Db diad.

Maybe I'm just not hearing what you're hearing, Note. I agree it's not strong resolution. But I can see ending a song there and people going "oh, I get it, it's over."

It's not a pop song, but I can see it working :)

And that I think, gets into an important aspect of Music theory that is often lost in these discussions -- what we accept as sounding acceptable, musically, is a cultural expectation. It is a matter of not merely exposure, but of immersion. Theory will tell us why something sounds the way it sounds, and give some clues to what might sound consonant and what might sound dissonant, but the reality is that consonance and dissonance are in the ear and mind of the listener, not in the "rules" of theory.

very true, I remember the first time I heard free jazz i thought it was a load of poop. Couldn't get my head around what they were doing with all these psycho chords and strange ideas. Now I love it, because i've listened to it and can see it from a different perspective. Same with more brutal music, at first it just sounded like lots of yelling and screaming to me, but i stuck it out, learned lots about where they were coming from and the basic elements of the style, and now I love it.

One of the many joys of music is finding that you're able to listen to something strange and new and appreciate it.