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theory advice

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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 87
Topic starter  

i've been taking up jazz...or at least, a jazz style aproach to guitar. so far it's been somewhat painless. i've been memorizing the chord notes, chord building from the major scale, notes on the fret board (i've known anyways), notation is slow for me but i'm getting there, and intervals/ear development.

what i don't understand or know how to teach myself is harmonizing chords to the scales.

David Hodge lessons have been helpful and i'll be working through them. so any links to other FREE lessons would be nice. (i don't have much money now) also does anyone know some jazz standards that could make use of what i'm learning? that uses: major/minor 7ths, 9ths, suspended and comping.

so...is there anything else i should focus on? would a better understanding of modes help me with this? if so, how? and what's this about modes of the harmonc minor? :shock:

i know there's a lot of questions here, so even if i can get one or two answered....big thanks :D


   
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kingpatzer
(@kingpatzer)
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Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 2171
 

I know you've asked for "free" but honestly the best resource for understanding jazz guitar harmony I've found is The Complete Johnny Smith Approach to Guitar by Johnny Smith

For Jazz theory, harmony and scales in general, you can't go wrong with he Jazz Theory Book by Mark Levine

Those two books along with some serious effort and lots of listening to jazz guitar greats can take you a very long way.

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 87
Topic starter  

very cool King...it'll be a while b4 i can afford to order them...i'll look for it in the music store too.

you mentioned jazz guitar greats....the only jazz guitarist i can think of is Django. i go to see local jazz players every chance i get. any sujestions who else to listen to?


   
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NoteBoat
(@noteboat)
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Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 4921
 

For standards, get a copy of the Real Book - everybody uses it.

Guitar teacher offering lessons in Plainfield IL


   
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kingpatzer
(@kingpatzer)
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Joined: 18 years ago
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you mentioned jazz guitar greats....the only jazz guitarist i can think of is Django. i go to see local jazz players every chance i get. any sujestions who else to listen to?

Django Rhienhardt
Kenny Burrell
Joe Pass
Herb Ellis
Wes Montgomery
Johnny Smith
Hank Garland
Lenny Breau
Barney Kessel
Pat Martino
Dorado Schmidt
Jimmy Rosenberg
Charlie Christian
John McLaughlin
Derek Bailey
John Abercrombie
Tal Farlow
Pat Metheny
Eddie Lang
Al DiMeola
George Benson
Allan Holdsworth
Grant Green
John Scofield
Lee Ritenour
Jim Hall
Larry Coryell
Bill Frisell
Larry Carlton
Mike Stern
Bireli Lagrene
Emily Remler
Tuck Andress
Nguyen Le
Mark Stefani

And really dozens of others that I'm sure I should include but whose names aren't coming to me right now :)

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 87
Topic starter  

thanks guys...this will keep me going for a while...it'll be a week or two before i can get the books...till then there's lots for me to do on this site lesson wise. i got stacks of guitar player mags too with jazz lessons. now i have some of the basics of what they're talking about. or i think i do....

brings me to another question.

as i'm reviewing a lesson, https://www.guitarnoise.com/lessons/jazz-comping-1/ i come across the 1st chord progresson. there's a chord chart but i decide to play the chords as i know them and build the one i don't know. the chord i didn't know was the Bm7b5. i play the 1, b3, b7 for Bm7 then a b5. when i checked the chord chart the b5 was an octive high.

so...why is a b5 not a b12? likewise why is a 9th not a 2nd?....13 and 6 etc.


   
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Fretsource
(@fretsource)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 973
 

It's just a naming convention that's used in chord terminology.. It's not really referring to how many octaves a note is above the root.

The chord members of chords built from thirds are named from a two octave series of notes, e.g.:

CDEFGABCDEFGABC = 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15

So we call it a ninth rather than a second to allude to the fact that it has been derived from that series of notes. (1 3 5 7 9 or C E G B D - major ninth in this case). It doesn't matter about the pitch. It could be in the bass and we'd still call it a ninth.

Compare that to a SUS 2 chord, (1 2 5 or C D G) Here the use of 2 rather than 9 (for the same note, D) alludes to the fact that the third has simply been displaced by its neighbour, the second


   
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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 87
Topic starter  

ahhh....thanks fretsource...one mystery solved....many to go :)

i'll post more questions if i'm stuck. and i'll let you good folks know my progress. lol...even if i get too frustrated and quit after a week :wink:


   
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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Posts: 87
Topic starter  

back with a new question....it's likely a very basic thing and feel silly asking but i've played by ear so long. anyways...

i come across chords over the staff that has a slash: G/E. before i've always played the chord the sounds "right". either the G or the E. can anyone explain what it is and what i should do when this comes up?


   
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Misanthrope
(@misanthrope)
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Posts: 2261
 

That's G over E, ie, a G with a root note of E.

ChordsAndScales.co.uk - Guitar Chord/Scale Finder/Viewer


   
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Ignar Hillström
(@ignar-hillstrom)
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Joined: 20 years ago
Posts: 5349
 

Or in other words: G B D E, or a G6. The difference between a G6 and G/E is that a standard G6 has a G in the bass and the G/E has the E in the bass. So to be complete, G/E is the third invertion of the G6 chord: E G B D. And now the real kicker comes: a G/E is actually the normal voicing of a Em7. So you can play it like [0 2 2 0 3 0] or [x 7 9 7 8 7], to name just two options. Or you can take the regular open G chord and play the sixth string open [0 2 0 0 0 3].


   
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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 87
Topic starter  

very good.....thanks guys

:D :D :D :D


   
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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 87
Topic starter  

how would i go about playing F7/C or Ebmaj7/C ?


   
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NoteBoat
(@noteboat)
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There are lots of ways...

For F7/C, you might try x3x545
For Ebmaj7/C, maybe x31333

Guitar teacher offering lessons in Plainfield IL


   
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improvgtrplyr
(@improvgtrplyr)
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Joined: 17 years ago
Posts: 87
Topic starter  

There are lots of ways...

For F7/C, you might try x3x545
For Ebmaj7/C, maybe x31333

does it matter what octives of the notes are used? like, does the C have to be the bass note?

i guess it would because C is the 5th of F. it's funny but i think if it was written as C/F7 i would have had a better idea of how to play it.


   
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