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House of the Rising Sun

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(@musenfreund)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 5108
Topic starter  

Okay, time to get things happening down here again.  

Let's take this one on.  It's a beautiful tune.  I was reminded  of that recently at FarmAid when John Mellencamp and his band did a great performance of it.

David's lesson also gives an introduction to fingerpicking and to arpeggios.  It should be a nice change of pace (though I've got to confess that I play these arpeggios myself with a pick and not fingerpicking).

If you're rarin' to go, follow the link:
https://www.guitarnoise.com/article.php?id=57

Well we all shine on--like the moon and the stars and the sun.
-- John Lennon


   
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(@davidhodge)
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Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 4472
 

And I'll do my best to get the MP3s up for this by early next week. Maybe sooner if possible.

Peace


   
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(@anonymous)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 8184
 

David, thanks for an excellent lesson. It took me about 2 weeks or so to get this song to actually sound somewhat right.

I knew I was headed in the right direction when I played it for my day who is 50 something. He knew the song right away.

The only problem I have is the chord change from D to FMaj7. Although, it's a relatively easy chord to finger. The issue with me is that when picking I have to look at my picking hand, than my fretting hand with the FMaj7. No easy feat :)

I still have a little aprehension when I know this chord change is coming up. It's like, oh oh, here it comes, don't screw it up. :)

Thanks again David for an excellent lesson,

Lunarist


   
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(@musenfreund)
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Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 5108
Topic starter  

Personally, I play the mini-barre F on this song and not the F maj7, but I suspect the Fmaj7 is an easier chord change.  

I don't have my guitar here, so I'm playing air guitar trying to come up with advice.  Let's see if this works.

You've got the D fingered.  Slide up to the first fret with your index finger and back up one string.  As you're sliding up, move your other two fingers almost into position for a C chord -- the middle one forward one string in front of where the index finger is now and the ring finger one string in front of the middle finger.  

Keep thinking about the open C fingering. The F major 7 is almost exactly the open C except that there is no open G string.   It's like a compressed C chord.

I hope that makes sense.  That's how I think of it.  You might try practicing a few time by using this exercise.  Strum a measure of C then a measure of Fmaj7 until you feel comfortable with the Fmaj7 fingering.  Once you can do that comfortably, you'll find the move from D to Fmaj7 to be very similar to the move from D to C.

I hope that helps.

Well we all shine on--like the moon and the stars and the sun.
-- John Lennon


   
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(@markyesme)
Estimable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 153
 

I find it easiest to fret the F bass note first (ring vertically up two strings.  Then fretting the A and the C (as the positions relative to the F note are pretty easy).  This has the added benefit of getting your fingers in position in the right order for the arpeggio.

My biggest difficulty has been getting up to speed.  I think the right speed is somewhere between 80 and 100 beats a minute, with two triplets per measure.  I can just now do 80 fairly reliably.  I am really good below that speed, but it is too slow to sing it.

The Easy Song Database: http://www2.shore.net/~maryesme/bin/easy.cgi

Take part in its creation: https://www.guitarnoise.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=7


   
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(@estambre)
Estimable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 93
 

Hi!

95% of my guitar experience comes from Guitar Noise.
I mention this so that you realise it can be done.
I went through the lesson some time in February and I got real problems playing David's version. The difficulty to play the first version (the simple arpeggio pattern) disappears after a while. And notice I'm not saying a day: in my case it must have been three days (of course, I was busy with other stuff too). The other version must have taken a couple weeks until it began to sound alright. And has been improving since.
So it's not grab your gtr and strum straight away.

But the bottom line is: hang on in there.

On the other hand, I haven't tried to sing this. I thought arpeggiating and singing at the same time must be hard.
Markyesme: any comments from your experience?

I'll give it a try and say how it goes for me.


   
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(@markyesme)
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Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 153
 

Most of the fingerpicking I do is really regular beat (no syncopation), and I find singing to regular beat stuff (whether strummed or picked) to be fairly easy.  I get into trouble when there are a lot of rests or notes/strums on off beats.

The Easy Song Database: http://www2.shore.net/~maryesme/bin/easy.cgi

Take part in its creation: https://www.guitarnoise.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=7


   
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(@davidhodge)
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Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 4472
 

If you don't mind starting slowly, this particular song (most of the time anyway) lends itself to working on singing and playing at the same time. Especially if you count in 6/8...

                        1        2        3        4        5        6 (there)

Am          1 (is)  2        3        4        5        6 (a)

C             1 (house) 2  3        4        5        6  (in)

D             1 (New Or - ) 2 (-leans)  3     4     5     6  

Fmaj7       1        2        3        4        5        6 (they) (etc...)

Rereading this, I hope it doesn't come across as silly as I think it sounds!

Peace


   
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(@markyesme)
Estimable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 153
 

No. Not silly.  But this isn't that easy until you get up to around 80 beats (1 beat is a quarter note) per minute 6/8 time.  Then it lends itself well to singing exactly as you describe.

The Easy Song Database: http://www2.shore.net/~maryesme/bin/easy.cgi

Take part in its creation: https://www.guitarnoise.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=7


   
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(@greybeard)
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Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 5840
 

Mark,

in 6/8 time the beat is an eighth note not a quarter and there are 6 of them to a bar (measure).

I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?
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(@markyesme)
Estimable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 153
 

On my metronome, it always measures the beat in quarter notes.  I have been working with the triplet setting (3 eighth notes) but setting the speed at 80.  It is twice as fast as when I set it to give me a 3/4 beat also at 80.  

That's what I meant with my post.  Sorry if I caused confusion with the way I wrote.  Thanks for keeping me on the straight and narrow :)

The Easy Song Database: http://www2.shore.net/~maryesme/bin/easy.cgi

Take part in its creation: https://www.guitarnoise.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=7


   
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(@violet-s)
Reputable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 342
 

Hi all, this is a very friendly version of this classic!  (The lesson book I have uses the full barre F chord, which made playing it a chore, tho barre chords are finally starting to be playable for me)

Yesterday when I started to play this version I sounded dreadful (one of those weeks when everything you play sounds awful), so I just tried to enjoy playing the notes and after a while it started sounding nice.

Today I had a go at singing along with it, quietly, and playing it slowly and that sort of came together.

This afternoon I went looking for any version of this song in the music shop, no luck there but got a collection of Dylan's which had Tangled Up in Blue and Hurricane on it (preparing for the future!)


   
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(@greybeard)
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Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 5840
 

No problem, mark.

I have an exercise that I sometimes use to help work out triplets and 1/16ths. Use your metronome set at a slow speed to start with and, starting at (say) the 3rd fret, play a quarter note on the beat - down (2-3-4) up (2-3-4) down (2-3-4), etc. When you feel comfortable, move on.

Now move  up four frets (you'll see the madness in my method shortly) and play triplets. This requires you to keep the quarter note rhythm - 1st bar starts on a down stroke, the next on an up stroke, down, up, etc. Get that going and then add another up-down in the middle. It will not take long to get them evenly spaced out and smooth.

Move down two frets and play 2 eighth notes - down (2) up (4) down (2) up (4) etc.

Get  used to this rhythm and then move up four frets and continue this rhythm, but double the speed - down-up-down-up, etc.

So, you now have a quarter note, 2 frets higher eighth notes, 2 frets higher than that triplets and finally 16th notes. The exercise is now to move from one "station" to another and play the rhythm on that fret. You quite quickly get into going to the "triplets fret" and playing in triplets and moving to the "16ths fret" and playing 16th notes.

I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?
Greybeard's Pages
My Articles & Reviews on GN


   
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(@musenfreund)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 5108
Topic starter  

Hi all, this is a very friendly version of this classic!  (The lesson book I have uses the full barre F chord, which made playing it a chore, tho barre chords are finally starting to be playable for me)

Yesterday when I started to play this version I sounded dreadful (one of those weeks when everything you play sounds awful), so I just tried to enjoy playing the notes and after a while it started sounding nice.

Today I had a go at singing along with it, quietly, and playing it slowly and that sort of came together.

This afternoon I went looking for any version of this song in the music shop, no luck there but got a collection of Dylan's which had Tangled Up in Blue and Hurricane on it (preparing for the future!)

Hey, Aretha,
Which Dylan book were you looking at?  
Is it this one?

If it is, it's good.  But if you haven't bought it yet, see if you can have them order this one for you:


The guitar tab edition.  It combines Amsco's other three Dylan songtab books and is a better buy.

Well we all shine on--like the moon and the stars and the sun.
-- John Lennon


   
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(@mordeth)
Estimable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 127
 

hi all

i love this song, so its really cool to be learning to play it now.
as already mentioned d to fmaj7 is a tough change to make while trying to watch both hands, but after a week of practice i can play the more difficult version fairly well (i think fingerpicking appeals to the piano player in me :p)...the only problem i have is speed. im pretty sure its supposed to be up there around 120bpm, but im no-where near to that right now :(

great lesson tho :)
ill let you all know next week how the speed thing goes

waves
mord

This is my signature. Fear it.


   
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