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Chord Progressions

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(@call_me_kido)
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I'm going to keep this short, because Im not trying to make a lesson here. Just a suggestion for all you stumped players out there looking for something to work on.

I find that taking a chord proggression in a given key and then transposing it to all the others is a great way to. . .

A.) Discover important chords in every key.

B.) Discover relationships of chords in a given key.

C.) Practice new chord shapes and develop an ear for songwriting.

So try this out.

This is a proggresion we are all very familliar with, it was used by the majority of songs from the 50's-60's and also alot to day. I know this is really simple stuff here and Im not trying to break new ground with it, just giving some perspective.

I VI IV V

C Am F G

So the next time you want to sit down and learn some new chords, rather then sit down with one of those 15,000 chord books with a million repetative diagrams take a chord proggression like: I - VI - IV - V, or a blues proggression, I - I - IV - V etc and transpose it to all your 12 chromatic keys.

THEN, go to your 15,000 chord book, choose 4 non-open possition fingerings that you dont know and run it through your circle of 5ths. . .

so, choose a proggression lets say. . . . I-II-III-IV (nice bridge maybe)

choose a beginning key (circle of 5ths likely starting with C) plug in your chords.... I-II-III-IV = C-Dm-Em-F and play it using the chords your learning.

Circle of fifths dictates beginning on C... C,G,D,A,E,B,F#,C#....etc for flats.

Youre learning 4 new chords

The relationship of those chords in all 12 keys

The fretboard

Dual hand efficiency

I know this is common sense, but maybe someone will sit down and do this tonight, when otherwise they wouldnt. Thats what counts.

Also if this seems a little bit too simple for you, try expanding the proggresion, maybe even at random.

I-II-VI-IV-V-V-IV-II-I or something like that,

or take substitution chords in the key. Stack your sevenths or use aumented and diminished chords, might not be a hit single, but this is practice not performance. Or is it???

Kido


   
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(@alangreen)
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Joined: 22 years ago
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As an additional to this, once you've done the I-vi-IV-V progression, play it through again using 7ths, 9ths, add9ths, 11ths, 13th and suspensions. Then try it in different positions up the neck. Then change key. You'll fry your brain for a while, but the benefits will soon become apparent.

Best,

A :-)

"Be good at what you can do" - Fingerbanger"
I have always felt that it is better to do what is beautiful than what is 'right'" - Eliot Fisk
Wedding music and guitar lessons in Essex. Listen at: http://www.rollmopmusic.co.uk


   
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(@argus)
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Also, try mixing chords from the parallel minor into a progression.

For instance, you have C major.

C - Dm - Em - F - G - Am - Bm(b5)

Then you have C minor.

C - Dm(b5) - Eb - Fm - G* - Ab - Bb - C

* = G or G minor - take your choice - the Gm comes from C aeolian.

This opens up a lot of new sounds.

You could play the 4 bar progression C - Gm - F - Fm
or C - G - Ab - Bb
or C - Eb - F - Bb
or C - F - Ab - G

I suppose you could do this with any mode of C, not just aeolian.

Like C locrian, which has C(b5) - Db - Ebm - Fm - Gb - Ab - Bbm.

From mixing that with the major you could get C - F - Db - G
or if you mix all the modes I've discussed you could get (excuse the notation) ||: C | C | Bb Bbm | F Fm :||

Remember kids, any chord progression can "fit". Hell, I've come up with strange - almost random - progressions, and they fit like an epileptic when you connect them with a melody.


   
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(@planetalk)
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I see it this way:

The key consists of 7 chords. I ii iii IV V vi vii

Each of those chords has a particular function within the key. The three majors are the primary chords (upper case roman numerals), the others are the minors and the half diminished (lower case).

Imagine that the key is actually an apartment with 7 rooms, each with its own function, like kitchen, living room, laundry, bedroom etc.

You can get to know the layout of that apartment, go from room to room, understand the function of each.

That's one key.

Now imagine an apartment block 12 stories tall. Each floor is identical in layout, all rooms in exactly the same relationship and having the same function.

That's all of Music.

Kirk

Kirk


   
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(@argus)
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If that was "all of music" I'd have sold my guitar a long time ago.


   
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(@planetalk)
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Why is that?

Kirk


   
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(@argus)
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Well what I mean is that tonally there are many more ways of thinking about things than as being in separate keys. You could write a melody that didn't stick to any real scale and put appropriate chords behind it that don't belong in any singular key. The chords might not really maintain their traditional function, but it can still sound good.

Case in point, "Almost Gothic" by Steely Dan. It's all over the shop, tonally speaking as it doesn't follow any "normal" rules of music theory, but it still comes together nicely.

Thinking about tonality as a building with 12 floors is a little limited when it comes to microtonal music or basically anything else that doesn't use traditional western concepts of music.

You wouldn't consider rhythm to be a house of 4 rooms when you can write a rhythm in many different metres, add or remove beats to/from bars at your own will, or use polyrhythms, would you?


   
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(@planetalk)
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I didn't say you weren't allowed to visit other floors, did I? Still, I stand by what I wrote: all scales, chords, modes, double stops, keys, all are part of this 12 story block. Even the tune you mention fits into that music building, or are you suggesting that some pieces follow no rules at all? Surely not.

The post was an analogy for those who are wondering about how Western music is structured, not microtonal music. I'm not an expert on microtonal or Eastern music, but I have been playing Western music since 1961.

Strange how different people react ... I posted an article at another site using this analogy, and someone wrote me a personal email saying: "Your Article changed my life...considering my life is guitar". You have chosen to dismiss it ... that's OK.

I didn't understand the rhythm analogy, sorry. My post was in answer to the original question, about chords and the like.

Kirk


   
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(@greybeard)
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Kirk,
I have been playing Western music since 1961

That makes you old enough for membership, so welcome to the GN Old Fart's Club :lol: :lol:

I'll go with the analogy of an apartment block - rooms with particular functions laid out the same one every floor.

The rhythm of music, though, is how you move around the apartment, sometimes quicker and more energetically than other times, when you kind of saunter around. You don't always move from room to room the same way- you change speed, mood, step, etc..
There's the rhythm factor.

I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?
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(@planetalk)
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There ya go!

Oh yes, and the best way to get to another floor is through the bedroom window ... being the V chord, of course. Then you're back in the familiar layout.

One more thing: for those thinking "12 X 7 chords? ... don't worry, there aren't that many. Any given (triad) chord shows up on 3 different floors, but as different rooms. Discounting that pesky vii chord, the half diminished, there are 12 major and 12 minor chords to worry about. That's only 24, not 84.

So, for example, a Bm chord can be:

the ii chord (laundry?) of A floor.
the iii chord (bathroom?) of G floor
the vi chord (kitchen?) of the D floor

Or, of couse, the i chord of Bm. But that's the same layout anyway. That's kind of like sleeping in the living room.

Kirk

Kirk


   
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(@argus)
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I didn't say you weren't allowed to visit other floors, did I? Still, I stand by what I wrote: all scales, chords, modes, double stops, keys, all are part of this 12 story block. Even the tune you mention fits into that music building, or are you suggesting that some pieces follow no rules at all? Surely not.

The post was an analogy for those who are wondering about how Western music is structured, not microtonal music. I'm not an expert on microtonal or Eastern music, but I have been playing Western music since 1961.

Strange how different people react ... I posted an article at another site using this analogy, and someone wrote me a personal email saying: "Your Article changed my life...considering my life is guitar". You have chosen to dismiss it ... that's OK.

I didn't understand the rhythm analogy, sorry. My post was in answer to the original question, about chords and the like.

What I meant by the rhythm analogy was that it's absurd to stick it all into a little user-friendly package. You can't simplify music like that. Well you can, I'm not stopping you, but the more you simplify it the more you leave out. For instance, chords that are neither major or minor (sus2/sus4) don't fit into your building. Chords with altered fifths don't really fit either, unless you count the vii. You said it covers all scales but that's very open to interpretation - I don't see how it covers the whole tone (augmented) and diminished scales, or any exotic scales for that matter, unless you really stretch. I'm not saying that your analogy makes no sense, I'm just saying that it's not "all of music" since there's just so much stuff out there that doesn't naturally fit into your musical apartment block.

That Steely Dan song would fit into your building, sure, but it doesn't follow the structure of the building efficiently enough to use the building as a frame of reference.

And microtonality isn't strictly confined to eastern music - Frank Zappa dabbled with half and quarter tones for a bit, and a lot of electronic artists have been experimenting with them for years.

Finally, I AM suggesting that some pieces follow no rules at all, or at least not the rules you posted. Captain Beefheart's "Trout Mask Replica" album springs to mind as not fitting into your 24-chord analogy, and that's still selling 35 years later.


   
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(@planetalk)
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Hi again argus.

I actually find that I can simplify music ... all the detail you're mentioning is just that: detail. 12 story apartments blocks have detail too; no question about that.

I wrote that for people who are still grappling with the notion of keys, related chords, I chords, ii chords, etc. You obviously know all that stuff. Good for you. Why wouldn't you want me to simplify things for them. What are you saying to them? "It's very. very complicated ... there is very little hope to learn any of it ... there are no easy ways to think of it, it's SO complicated." I find that absurd.

If my building contains all 12 notes, how can it not contain all music?

Anyway, to each their own style of passing on their playing experience. I'll stick to mine, thanks, I have 41 years under my belt. I'm entitled. How many years do you have?

Kirk


   
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(@greybeard)
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I'm still with Kirk, here.
To continue the analogy - yes 12 floors, each floor one apartment with 7 rooms - but each room can be furnished differently, just as in real life. Some people have double beds, others singles or bunk beds. You can put a TV in your bedroom, bathroom or closet, if you like, etc., etc.. They are all things that embellish an empty room.

The reason I go with the simple analogy, is that I have spent many years making technical presentations to all levels of staff, from board members down to "lowly" developers - all in the same room at the same time. You have to get your point across, so that the basic idea sticks in everybody's mind - and the best way to do that is to make an analogy to everyday life.
Once the listener has the basic concept, you can flesh it out with a certain level of detail, to the point where the analogy is, probably, no longer valid, but, by that stage, the listener has grasped sufficient information to not need the analogy anymore.

I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?
Greybeard's Pages
My Articles & Reviews on GN


   
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(@argus)
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Hi again argus.

I actually find that I can simplify music ... all the detail you're mentioning is just that: detail. 12 story apartments blocks have detail too; no question about that.

I wrote that for people who are still grappling with the notion of keys, related chords, I chords, ii chords, etc. You obviously know all that stuff. Good for you. Why wouldn't you want me to simplify things for them. What are you saying to them? "It's very. very complicated ... there is very little hope to learn any of it ... there are no easy ways to think of it, it's SO complicated." I find that absurd.

If my building contains all 12 notes, how can it not contain all music?

Anyway, to each their own style of passing on their playing experience. I'll stick to mine, thanks, I have 41 years under my belt. I'm entitled. How many years do you have?

I've only been playing for 5 years, but I still know enough to be able to form a valid opinion on it. I get all my money (a pittance really) from teaching guitar and music theory, believe it or not. Granted, you've been doing this for much longer than I have, but there's no need to flaunt it to prove a point.

What I've been having a problem with is not the analogy as such (it has a few flaws but it's still useful for beginners), but the phrase you used - "That's all of music". Yes, most music out there that we listen to uses those 12 notes/24 chords and yes, that's the kind of music that most people want to learn to play, but "all of music"? What about music that is purely percussion? What about instruments like the didgeridoo that generate a tone yet don't fit into the whole 12TET world of instruments? What about someone rapping to nothing but a beat?

As for: Why wouldn't you want me to simplify things for them. What are you saying to them? "It's very. very complicated ... there is very little hope to learn any of it ... there are no easy ways to think of it, it's SO complicated." I find that absurd.

Well so do I, but I'm not the one who said it. In fact, I find it insulting that you not only put words into my mouth, but also went out of your way to dismiss it. Nobody knows everything there is to know about music because it isn't something static - it changes all the time. Styles come and go, instruments go in and out of fashion, and while most share a common "backbone" they all bring new ideas to the table. You can say that 12 notes/24 chords is "all of music" if you want to, as it is a major part of music, but we both know there's much more to it than that.

While I'm incredibly impressed with your track record (playing with Richard Clapton is pretty cool) and your guitar book, I think we're from two completely different schools of thought when it comes to the wider world of music and we're both too stubborn to think any differently.


   
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(@noteboat)
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Quite the discussion here!

Both sides have some nice points... Planetalk's analogy is simplistic; although it's great for beginners, and fine for most rock music, it's not practical when you start getting into chord substitutions and such - 'instead of playing the bathroom chord, you can play the kitchen chord three floors up or the dining room chord five floors down' would result.

But we all learn by making things simple, and learning the exceptions later. When we learn rhythm, we're taught that a quarter note represents a beat - it's not until later on that we discover it's two beats in 3/8, half a beat in alla breve, and two-thirds of a beat in compound 6/8.

So... I was leaning towards that side. Even though it's true that there's music that doesn't follow the rules, and Argus makes other valid points, I saw Kirk's purpose as simplification for beginners.

Then I started thinking about the way that I teach chords and progressions to beginning guitarists: starting out with I-IV-V, then i-iv-V, so they can cover most familiar songs, then moving into the scales that make the chords, then the natural harmonic motion of roots. I started wondering how I could incorporate his analogy, and I found I can't, because it's got a serious flaw that hasn't been addressed:

Sometimes the bedroom turns out to be the bathroom.

If 'all of music' fits into the apartment block, with twelve floors, one for each key, then each floor contains both a major and relative minor key. Since the analogy is being applied to chord progressions, I can't grasp how the major key's iii chord and the minor key's V chord can peacefully room together - the E root chord will be the iii if you've gone in the front door (C major key), and the V if you've gone in the back door (A minor key).

So... even though it sounds good, and it's probably useful for helping a beginner overcome fear that there's 'too much stuff to learn', I'm not sure it has any practical application for teaching.

Guitar teacher offering lessons in Plainfield IL


   
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