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Lower Tuning, Heavy Gauge Strings & Intonation

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(@shadewalker)
Active Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 16
Topic starter  

Hi, I'm new.

I play in C# tuning (all strings tuned down 1½ from standard tuning). For that purpose I use 12 - 56 gauge strings (Ernie Ball Not Even Slinky). I found these strings to work best for the way I play (tried different gauges before that, even Everly 12-60 gauge!). Anyway, two of my strings seem to result in sharp notes (not really that bad) up and including the 12th fret. However, this is when I have moved the according saddles all the way back. Can't move them any further, and moving forward would result in worse sharp notes.

I'm pretty sure my truss rod is in order, I did some experimental changes and it seemed to change nothing on the issue. I eventually set it a way I like it (offering some extra action due to the thick strings to prevent fret buzz). I also set string action on the bridge just above the buzz limit, as it should be.

I'm suspecting the "standard" bridge my guitar is equipped with (Ibanez SA120) does not offer sufficient adjustment possibilities, OR...

To begin with I hadn't really considered this, but I had to do a few "hacks" on the nut before equipping the strings due to the fact, the they would not exactly fit in the holes. I basically took the 56-gauge string and used it to file the hole so it would fit. It seemed an excellent idea because the hole would not end up wider than necessary. I repeated the same procedure with a few other strings. The two lightest ones fit perfectly. However, there is a possibility that, while laying on the nut, the strings are to high above the fretboard on that position, especially the 24-gauge plain string (I couldn't use this one as a file since it's unwound!).

Any suggestions are appreciated, especially if you have any experience on such guitar setups. Thanks in advance! 8)


   
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(@gnease)
Illustrious Member
Joined: 20 years ago
Posts: 5038
 

If strings are too high at the nut, then they will be sharp near the nut and be closer to in tune further up the neck -- the opposite of your problem. It does sound as if your problem is at the bridge. Is this a floating vibrato (trem) bridge? If so, have you properly set up the trem spring tension for your gauge and tuning to float the bridge in the right position? If not, what can happen is the bridge may be pulled "up" or tilted forward so much, that all the saddles are now too far forward. If this is the case, you would need to increase the spring tension to pull the bridge back and down, and this should effectively lengthen the nut to saddle distance. At that point, you will need to re-set the intonation. If yours is a hardtail (non-trem), then you may simply have run out of compensation range as you've spectulated. I have a 5-string bass with this issue on the low B -- it's not unheard of.

Welcome to GN.

-=tension & release=-


   
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(@shadewalker)
Active Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 16
Topic starter  

gnease,

After reading your post, I went to inspect my bridge and yes, it's tilted forward due to the pull of the strings - quite far, actually. I'm not sure if I understand the term "floating vibrato/tremolo" bridge, but mine seems to match your description.

I searched on Google for guitar and/or spring and/or adjustment but found nothing of relevance, but I can check my manual that followed with the guitar. I assume adjusting it involves temporarily removing the cover on the back of the guitar to gain access to the springs?

I also check how the strings intonate on different frets, and, as you mentioned, on a few strings seem to be to produce barely sharp notes the closer to the nut you get, while the note on the 12th fret. The sharp notes are not too bad, so I'll leave this lesser inconvenience for when I'm done with the bridge.

Thanks for your help!


   
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(@u2bono269)
Noble Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 1167
 

I would say you want to add extra springs. The guitar probably has 3 springs in there, so I recommend buying more and using a total of 5. I use 5 springs on my ibanez even though i have REALLY light strings and use standard tuning, just because i like the extra tension when i use the whammy. You may also want to consider blocking the tremolo off, assuming you dont use it that much. There are places online that can show you how to do this.

http://www.brianbetteridge.com


   
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(@ciaran)
Eminent Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 31
 

If you take the cover off the back, you should see two long screws that hold the plate the springs attach to in place. If that sentence sounds confusing, it may become clearer when you open it up and take a look.

Tightening the screws will pull the bridge lower, loosening them will let the strings pull it higher. You need to adjust the screws until the bridge is level, but this can take several goes because if you adjust the screws, you then need to retune, which moves the bridge again.

(Disclaimer: This is what I do to mine, but I don't take responsibility for your guitar - if you're unsure, wait until someone more competent confirms I'm talking sense. :wink: )


   
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 Nils
(@nils)
Famed Member
Joined: 20 years ago
Posts: 2849
 

I think Ciaran is pretty close and should work. I think there are 2 variations, one with 2 screws and one with 6 screws but they work just about the same from an adjustment point of view. Here is a good writeup on the Fender site that may help.

Fender setup

Nils' Page - Guitar Information and other Stuff
DMusic Samples


   
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(@shadewalker)
Active Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 16
Topic starter  

That was exactly what I thought when I opened up the cover and found the screws. I will try to tighten them, perhaps even mount 2 additional springs to reduce the length I have to move the the screws inward.

Thanks for the input, everyone. I'll post again to let you know the outcome.


   
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(@shadewalker)
Active Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 16
Topic starter  

Okay - a while ago a mounted 2 additional springs and adjusted the two screws to level the bridge, then reset the intonation - even increased the action. It seemed to help. It's not perfect - as gnease suggested, the bridge doesn't offer the compensation range, but it's only a minor inconvenience. Sounds much better.

Thanks, guys.


   
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