Skip to content
Can a home recordin...
 
Notifications
Clear all

Can a home recording sound professional? Help me!

14 Posts
7 Users
0 Likes
4,473 Views
(@a-better-half)
Active Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 4
Topic starter  

Hi there, my name is Graham and I am new. Doubtless, some of the topics I'm going to cover here have been covered before, but I haven't seen them all in one place before, and since I bet I'm not the only one having this problem, it can always be useful to put everything in one place. So hopefully you'll all be able to give me the benefit of your experience and wisdom.

Basically, what I'm wondering is, how can I make my home recordings sound as good as something recorded in a pro studio? I listen to the songs my band has recorded in my basement and then throw on the latest Broken Social Scene or whatever other band, and our songs sound like we recorded them in a basement whereas the Social Scene sounds like a 'real CD'. There must be a way to make my recordings sound that good, or at least much closer.

My setup is as follows: Recording in my basement (I'm 18 and live at home, so the basement is also the family room with the TV etc etc), plugging through an M-Audio Firewire 410 silver box (I have little to no technical knowledge, by the way), into Garageband 2.0 on a Dual processor Mac G5. For Microphones I use a 'Studio Projects B1' Single Diaphragm Condensor mic or AKG d880 Dynamic. I also have access to a variety of other mics, too, which I will likely be borrowing for my next recording project. My band is a standard rock band: drums, guitar, bass, keyboards, vocals, and the occasional auzillary percussion or group vocals. So, I have a few specific questions and of course would be happy to take any other advice or wisdom you may have.

1: I know that Garageband isn't by any means a top end recording program, but I've usually been able to get fairly good results with it. However, I do have access to Cubase SX. Would it be a better move for me to switch to Cubase, or is it possible to get the results I crave using Garageband?

2: Will using duvets, mattresses etc. to deaden sounds and get better acoustics work, or is there no alternative to investing in some pricey bass traps, etc?

3: Should I try and get an external compressor, or will the ones in the software suffice?

4: Mastering: I don't understand it at all, but I understand its importance. Can I do it on my computer, or will I have to get it done elsewhere?

Sorry for the lengthy post. My band is hellbent on making a really good sounding record, but we have next to no funds, and prefer the freedom that recording at home allows. Is this just a pipe dream, or is possible to make a pro sounding CD in my basement, using what resources I have? Thanks a lot!


   
Quote
(@kingpatzer)
Noble Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 2171
 

"How can I make my home recordings sound as good as something recorded in a pro studio?"

Spend several tens of thousands of dollars, and have a friend who is a professional sound engineer willing to help you out on weekends.

You will never get an M-audio Firewire to sound like a Neve console.

Still, to give you some answers:

1) The software isn't nearly as important as the techniques used to get the sound. The Beatles managed to do some impressive things off of a tape 4 track after all :0

2) It will help some, but not enough. If you want to play in-doors and sound good, you have to do some real soundproofing. You can build some inexpensive bass traps, the plans for which are found all over the internet. Any reverberations will get picked up on the mic.

3) I am a firm believer in rack gear, but that is definitely "old school" these days. More and more guys are getting good results using plug-ins and software only effects. The key is to really learn what the software can do and research the available effects to make sure that the plug-in you're using will be capable of giving you the results you want.

4) You can burn from an ISO image on your hard-drive if you're going to burn all your discs yourself. But that will wear out your CD-RW drive pretty quick if you're going to be burning a couple 1,000 CD's. It also isn't very cost-efficient.

It's possible to make a very high quality demo at home. Unless you've invested several thousand dollars in your home system, it is not possible to produce a studio quality release. But most people aren't going to be able to tell the difference. Nor are they really going to expect true studio quality from someone they're buying CD's from off the stage from.

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
ReplyQuote
(@lee-n)
Estimable Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 142
 

I agree with pretty much all what Kingpatzer says but I would put emphasis on these two quotes, I think they should have gone into the same sentence..
You will never get an M-audio Firewire to sound like a Neve console

It's possible to make a very high quality demo at home. Unless you've invested several thousand dollars in your home system, it is not possible to produce a studio quality release. But most people aren't going to be able to tell the difference

In my early days of recording I was in the same trap, convinced by magazines and other people that equipment was the problem. The one thing that none of them ever cared to mention was "most people aren't going to tell the difference".

The bottom line is that extremely good results can be obtained on cheap recording equipment more so now than ever since the introduction of computers and half decent sound cards like the M-audio, certainly not proffessional but more than adaquate, there is a pretty thin line between prosumer and proffessional to many peoples ears.

Knowledge and experience will be your biggest battle but a bit of willingness to experiment and you could get yourself doing a half decent recording in a few months. You haven't actually described the process you are using to record the band so its hard to give you any specific help but here's a few tips.

I don't know the software you are using but try to use something like cubase or any other sequencer that is compatible with vst plugins... not because they are necessarily better but simply because there are so many good free vst plugs available on the net.

As Kingpatzer has said already, acoustic treatment can make a big difference however at this stage I'm going to guess this isn't your main problem just yet but probably will be at some point.

Real drums can be difficult to get good results if you are inexperienced with recording them, are you using real drums and how are you micing them??

Always listen carefully to the sound at source.. if it doesnt sound good going in then it won't sound good coming out... forget the fix it in the mix arguments.

If you are making heavy music then experiment with recording the guitar parts a few times to separate tracks (all played separately) and play about with eq, effects and imaging, try a few different things to make the guitars sound big. Guitars are rarely recorded just once.

If you can, post a recording and also give a detailed description of exactly how you are going about recording your band and the setup you are using.

Lee


   
ReplyQuote
(@hueseph)
Noble Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 1543
 

To further add the those comments.
-unless you are going to mic the room for ambience, you don't need to concern yourself too much with acoustics. Generally in a home recording environment you will concentrate on close micing, unless of course you have an exceptionally nice sounding room.
Standing waves will only come into play when you do your mix and at that, so long as you are using close monitors, it shouldn't be too much of a problem. Use a good set of headphones to check the midrange. Be careful not to use headphones that accentuate bass frequencies. This is also something to be aware of when you select your monitors. Many consumer models are designed to "enhance" the sound of your music. Try to select monitors that have a flat frequency response.

-I wouldn't concern yourself with an external compressor unless you are very familiar with using them. Once you add hardware compression to your recording you can't remove it. In that sense, software compressors have their advantages.

-You can get very good quality using a decent soundcard (m-audio,RME, Hammerhead, Echo, MOTU to name a few) and Garage band. If you have the budget, go ahead and spend the money on Cubase, Live or other software but be prepared for what could be an extensive learning curve not to mention the time it will take to tweak your system to a workable state.

- I would recommend that if you decide to take home recording seriously, to dedicate a machine to recording or if you can, run a dual boot machine with one partition strictly for audio.

-Mastering absolutely should be done by a professional who specializes in the field. Mastering is far more than just tweaking your mix. It is what takes your project from being a collection of songs to being a cohesive album of music that is consistent and ready for duplication.

Many recent releases have been started and even completed for the most part in home studios. "Remy Shand" and "The Donnas" come to mind.

https://soundcloud.com/hue-nery/hue-audio-sampler


   
ReplyQuote
(@a-better-half)
Active Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 4
Topic starter  

Hey everyone, thanks a lot for the replies- very helpful. I'll give you a rundown of how I've been recording the band up to this point, as best I can recall. The only time we've really recorded here, we were just trying to put something together to sell at shows for two bucks a pop, so I can't say I rememevbr exactly how we did it, since it was all done quickly and haphazardly. Nevertheless.

We started with drums and bass. Since the M-Audio box only has two inputs and we only had two mics, we just stuck the condenser at a point near the drums that we thought sounded good. Then we put an open hard shell bass case draped in blankets between the drums/mic and the bass amp, which was mic'd with the dynamic. For one song, we did that with the guitar instead of the bass (it made sense at the time) Recorded those together. Then overdubbed the guitar, mic'ing the amp with the dynamic again (I think. Maybe it was the condenser...). Did the same with the keyboards (these aren't fancy synths, they're old keyboards and we liked how they sounded through amps). We recorded the vocal strangely, though. We were going for that Julian Casablancas (The Strokes) vocal sound, so we actually plugged the mic into our PA and then outputted that into an amp with some gain on it. Interesting result, though it would probably make audiophiles weep. Mixed the whole thing in Garageband, hit the "export to iTunes' button, and then made a playlist and burned a CD. If you want to hear some samples of this, head over to http://www.myspace.com/tokyopoliceclub . The tracks Nature of the Experiment, Be Good and Cheer It On are the ones that I recorded in my basement. The other is from a different basement, using slightly more professional techniques but in just as rushed a fashion.

Obviously, this method is enormously flawed and rushed. Just taking some time to work on things will probably make everything sound loads better. Similarily, I'll be getting my hands on a MOTU firewire box with more inputs, so we can properly mic the drums.

In terms of bass, would you all advise that we D.I. it? The bass amp we're using isn't anything special, and I'm thinking it might help in terms of not having so much mic hiss all over the place. If we are D.I.ing bass, we need some sort of amp before we plug it in, right? How would we go about getting our hands on that?

And one more amateur question: for monitors, would our PA speakers work, or is that a terrible terrible idea that betrays my ignorance?

Thanks again for your help!!


   
ReplyQuote
(@hueseph)
Noble Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 1543
 

I think you will find that your pa speakers are far too loud to use as monitors.

https://soundcloud.com/hue-nery/hue-audio-sampler


   
ReplyQuote
(@hueseph)
Noble Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 1543
 

BTW. "Nature of the experiment" Sounds great considering your methods. A better mic might help the vocals out. Try not to eat the mic when you record. While it might be habit on stage it doesn't complement your vocals. Try looking into a cheap condenser and a tube pre. The drums sound great considering. There's some noticeable clipping in the guitar and in the vox. It sounds like the mic itself is clipping. While this can be desirable to an extent, it's a bit too much.

The tunes are great! Remind me of early punk. Somewhere between the Pistols, the Clash and Talking Heads.

The mix need help. The panning is great but it's a bit muddy sounding. Too much clipping going on. The bass is barely audible.

https://soundcloud.com/hue-nery/hue-audio-sampler


   
ReplyQuote
(@a-better-half)
Active Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 4
Topic starter  

BTW. "Nature of the experiment" Sounds great considering your methods. A better mic might help the vocals out. Try not to eat the mic when you record. While it might be habit on stage it doesn't complement your vocals. Try looking into a cheap condenser and a tube pre. The drums sound great considering. There's some noticeable clipping in the guitar and in the vox. It sounds like the mic itself is clipping. While this can be desirable to an extent, it's a bit too much.

The tunes are great! Remind me of early punk. Somewhere between the Pistols, the Clash and Talking Heads.

The mix needs help. The panning is great but it's a bit muddy sounding. Too much clipping going on. The bass is barely audible.

Actually, I think for Nature of the Experiment we were using the condenser. Studio Projects B1. In which case, we obviously need to work on our mic'ing technique... In terms of the mix, what do you think would help the muddiness? Less clipping? Some EQ? Or maybe just shutting up and trying it myself until it sounds good?


   
ReplyQuote
(@hueseph)
Noble Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 1543
 

Rule of thumb with condensers: keep 6"-10" away from the capsule unless you are doing rap and are trying to accentuate the vocals, making use of proximity effect.(essentially the bass frequencies reproduce well at close proximity to the mic). Being that rap is far removed from your agenda, that's not a concern.

The thing with condensers is that although they respond well in close micing situations dealing with high sound pressure levels but the capsules are ultra sensitive and don't take well to plosives like loud "p"s and "t"s. Actually, just blowing on the capsule can damage it.

In the matter of those vocals, I think this is one case when a good dynamic mic will really help. An SM57/58 or a good knock off would work well. The B1 works better with softer voices and acoustic instruments, tho it does work well close micing guitar cabs.

Regarding the mix: It's necessary that you train your ears toward cleaning up the mix. When a lot of instruments share the same frequencies it can cause a lack of clarity. This can be remedied by panning but that is a bandaid solution. Listen hard. Sometimes an awsome sounding guitar will sound horrible in the mix. Spen more time A/Bing. That is compare/solo/adjust/compare. Just taking the time to be more critical will help a lot. But it really sounds like you have the knack so keep doing what you're doing. Just remember to step back once in a while. Even walk away for a few hours. Listen again and decide whether or not you still like your mix.

They say it take 20 years to become a recording engineer.

https://soundcloud.com/hue-nery/hue-audio-sampler


   
ReplyQuote
(@danlasley)
Noble Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 2118
 

Read some of these articles from our sister site. Some discuss exactly what you are talking about.

http://www.musiccareers.net/studio.php

Laz


   
ReplyQuote
(@brandondrury)
Active Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 13
 

Keep in mind, that big boy bands will frequently rent out a cabin and record the entire records there. I know Rick Rubin uses his living room for recording all the time. So in the end, it's really the quality of people involved on the project that makes the biggest difference.
-unless you are going to mic the room for ambience, you don't need to concern yourself too much with acoustics. Generally in a home recording environment you will concentrate on close micing, unless of course you have an exceptionally nice sounding room.
Standing waves will only come into play when you do your mix and at that, so long as you are using close monitors, it shouldn't be too much of a problem.
AHHHHH!!!!!!

I have to argue....a lot.

People are mentioning that you need Neve , but you don't need amazing acoustics for someone who is trying to really crank out a pro recording. Since I've done about 60 records in a studio with outboard Neve preamps and crappy rooms, I can tell you that without a doubt, acoustics is 100x as important as the gear you use. I'm saving like crazy right now. I plan on paying an acoustical engineer to design the damn thing for me. The acoustics are that important to me.

First of all, there are varying degrees of poor room. Some rooms are flat out terrible. Usually because they are way too small. No matter how much treatment you do, the odds are strong that you will have a boxy sound in a tiny room. If you are lucky enough to record in a decent room, you are 50x ahead of someone in a tiny, boxy room. If you are in a decent room with enough size to avoid the boxiness, you may want to spend some cash on gear.

The notion that room acoustics do not effect close micing is flat out wrong. If you think in terms of "reverb" in a room, you are right, you won't hear the decay if you close mic. However, early reflections make an emormous amount of difference even when close micing. Forget the mic. Move your guitar cabinet around the room and listen. Grab your acoustic guitar and play all over the house and listen. Listen to the low end especially. Don't listen for the reverb (if you can block it out). Listen to the tone of the guitar.

Another test for this is to crank up a system with a subwoofer. Walk around the room. You'll hear places where the low end changes drastically. This is why placement of the instrument is critical.

I actually have a room node in my terrible room (even though I've bass trapped the hell out of it) where the low end essentially disappears. I mean, you palm mute on a distorted electric and you get no low end. Move the cabinet 3 feet, you get a tone of low end.

Brandon

Recording School


   
ReplyQuote
(@kingpatzer)
Noble Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 2171
 

People are mentioning that you need Neve , but you don't need amazing acoustics for someone who is trying to really crank out a pro recording.

Brandon, since I'm the one that brought up Neve, I never said you need one. I said that:
You will never get an M-audio Firewire to sound like a Neve console.

And you won't. It can't be done. I never said you can't do a good recording off of an M-audio pre-amp. But I did say that someone with a good ear and who has heard the difference can tell the difference.

As for accoustics, I said that cheap accoustic treatments won't do the job. Which means you're agreeing with me.

Since I'm the only one who mentioned Neve's, it seems that you're making me into a straw man. We'd probably have a much friendlier conversation if you wouldn't put words in my mouth.

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
ReplyQuote
(@hueseph)
Noble Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 1543
 

Not sure I understand. You're saying that early reflection will affect the sound on a mic that is a couple of inches away from the cone? I'd have to take your word for it but I can't say I could see how. Now, maybe I just don't see the whole picture. I could see how it might affect the tone when micing a band. I 've spent time enclosing an amp with baffles for the sake of Isolation and it didn't seem to affect the low end in a detrimental way. In fact there are boxes designed specifically for this. http://www.amptone.com/demeterssc1.htm . I can understand how it will affect an acoustic.

https://soundcloud.com/hue-nery/hue-audio-sampler


   
ReplyQuote
(@maxwell)
Estimable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 131
 

Sorry, I couldn't find the music on your website, but just wanted to point out a common EQ problem. EQ should be adjusted by finding frequencies that are similar between two signals (muddy) and detracting the freq from one signal to carve out space for the signal you want most present. Too often people think they should boost freqs to make one signal over power another. There are times when boosting a signal can be beneficial, but not that frequently. Always try cutting first.

As mentioned above, keep experimenting with mic and instrument placement. In trying to get an AM radio sound from an acoustic guitar, after hours of trying different effects and placement we finally achieved exactly the sound we were searching for by playing the guitar facing a steel door, about three feet away, with the condenser mic halfway between the guitar and the door, facing the door. Learn your room, what sound each position makes with each instrument. It takes time, but is necessary. Room acoustics are what they are, so you have to make the room work for you, not against you.

I always prefer to DI the bass guitar and mic an amp as well when I think that will add the sound I am trying to achieve.

I have never used Garageband, but if you have a decent set of treatments/effects (EQ, Compression, gates, limiters, what-have-you) my personal preference it to record the tracks as dry and clean as possible and color the tracks in the mixdown stage. That said, if you do find a room with great acoustics, use them to your best advantage. A good sound engineer can make a clean track sound great, but if it recorded with too much compression, faulty EQ, etc, its usually too late to do anything about it. If it ain't good goin' in, it ain't gonna be good comin' out.

He not busy being born is busy dying. - Bob Dylan (It's Alright Ma, I'm Only Bleeding)


   
ReplyQuote