Rondo Lap Steel

I'm actually quite happy with the cheap Chinese ceramic Strat pickup in it. If I end up with an extra Chinese Strat lipstick from GFS (as I may on eBay), I'll put it in there.

Yep, I've got two of those overwound Strat bridge lipsticks coming, a GFS and an Artec. (May be the same thing from the same Chinese factory.) One's going in the Allen Melbert and one's going in the SX.

BTW, I've written to Kurt at Rondo requesting an 8-string SX lap steel, which he passed along to SX. I also PM'd Gretsch on Myspace requesting an 8-string Electromatic lap steel. Got the reply "Great idea! THANKS!" If anyone else would be interested in these, wouldn't hurt to contact them yourself.
:D

BTW, I've got one of these lipsticks, the Artec, and I like how it sounds in the Allen Melbert. With the 8K winding it's not a very bright sounding pickup, but is a bit more so than the EMG Select, I think. Output seems to be a bit less.

Hi Folks, new here, just got one of these Rondo lap steels and need to get a practice amp, any suggestions? Also would a Seymor Duncan lipstick pickup work in this lap steel? Thanks for your help!

A Seymour Duncan lipstick made for a Strat will work in it great. A Danelectro style lipstick won't.

Try it for a while with the stock pickup. I like it. Nice bright tone.

I'll probably end up putting the GFS bridge lipstick in it, just because I have it and need to put it somewhere, but I've got no beef with the original.

Thanks for the reply about the pickup, now a question about strings, I see that they only sell two six string sets for lap steels, do you buy 8 or 10 string sets and use those, or is there another way? Suggestions on a decent pratice amp to use for lap steel, nothing to pricey, but still decent. Thanks again for your help!

Regular 6-string nickel electric guitar strings of suitable gauge for the tuning are what I use. If you want Open D, E, A or G, standard sets like .012-.054" will work OK. A set like the Martin Bluegrass Resonator Guitar .016-.056" will work very well. The short scale of most lap steels reduces string tension. If you get into 8 strings and don't want to make up your own sets, you'll have to buy steel string sets, same if you use a tuning like C6/Am7 that doesn't work with standard gauges.

And pretty much any electric guitar amp will work fine. I bought an Epiphone Valve Junior Combo specifically to be a lap steel amp. It's remarkably similar to many lap steel amps of the '40s and '50s, except that it's set up with overdrive if you turn the amp up past about 12:00 with humbuckers or P-90s, or past about 2:00 with single coils. Keep the gain down and use the guitar volume control.

I buy 013-056 sets from http://www.webstrings.com/electric_guitar_strings.html - works very well for E and G tunings on my 25" lap steel.

Thanks again for your help. One more question and I'll let you have a little peace and quite. A little about myself, I'm 60, never played any kind of musical instrument, know nothing about music except a few chords on a acuostic guitar. I tried to learn to play but due to really bad arthirits in my left hand just couldn't fret the chords. My brother can play extremly well and I would love more than anything to be able to play with him once in my life. Am now retired and have the time and will do what ever it takes to learn, hopefully this will not be as hard on my left hand. So if you could please point me in the direction of some good instructinal cd's, something even a dummy like me could learn from, I would be most appreciative. Thanks again for your help!!

Warder - there are many instructional CD/DVD/books for the C6 tuning, so I suggest you start with that tuning, especially since you don't have a 'solid' guitar background. Many guitarists (like me) find that tuning confusing at first, since very few of the notes are where we're used to, but for a total beginner that won't be an issue.

Here's a few suggestions:

Anyone Can Play C6 Lap Steel

Basic C6 Lap Steel Method

Lap Steel Guitar 101 C6th Tuning

I'll also suggest that you join the Steel Guitar Forum, it costs $5 and I learned more there since I joined almost 6 vyears ago than I would have from most instructional DVDs. The regular members there are real friendly and helpful, the lap steel sub forum is called "Steel Without Pedals" (it seems to be down right now, but do a Google search for it later and you'll get there). The forum also has its own shop where you can buy C6 strings sets at a very c'comfortable' price..

One more thing - most lap steel instructional maaterial will encourage the use of a round 'bullet' steel bar. I don't know how serious your arthiritis is, but if you find it difficult to hold such a bar I would recommend getting a 'dobro style' bar, like the Shubbs SP2 or GS Steel - http://www.shubb.com/steel/index.html
Especially the wooden handle of the GS Steel has made it a favorite among people who, for various reasons, have problems holding a regular bar. Gary Swallows, who invented the GS Steel, can also make you a custom model especially for your needs. You will find him here - http://www.gssteels.com/

Hope this helps, and good luck!

Excellent recommendations!

As for the C6 tuning, though, which I'm struggling to figure out right now, it's not nearly as accessible for just jumping in and making music as Open D or E, which is where most electric guitarists go first when they try lap steel. If you're into blues, Open D/E (same tuning patterns, a full tone apart in pitch) or Open G/A (Open A being the original popular "Hawaiian" tuning most lap steels were tuned to in the early days) will get you there. But C6 is enormously popular now for Hawaiian music, country, Western swing, jazz, etc. and is very versatile. From my perspective as a fairly new and inexperienced lap player, the various 6th, 7th and 9th chord tunings don't lend themselves readily to playing solo with a rhythm self-accompaniment as the old standard major chord tunings I mentioned do with bottleneck slide on a "Spanish" guitar or lap slide, playing in the root key of the tuning. I've come to lap steel from a bottleneck slide background, and using the same tunings it's very much the same. But for playing melody lines over a band backing in a variety of keys, minor and major, a tuning like C6 is very versatile. Think of it as something like a horn or fiddle. I absolutely love the "Hawaiian" sound you get fro lots of the "double stops" (two strings played together) in C6. Some of the old blues licks can be found there without much trouble, too. I'm finding it's pretty straightforward to find the melodies of lots of popular tunes (right now it's Christmas carols, like "We Three Kings", "O Come, Emmanuel," and such, which are tricky on a major chord-tuned guitar, without moving much out of a two-fret box. But I haven't gotten the hang of harmonizing them yet.

Don't overlook bottleneck slide, either. I have several friends who do that very successfully with arthritic or injured hands. (Where's Vic?) May be stylistically limited, but it's easy to learn and great fun! Especially for playing alone.

I have trouble with the round tone bar causing finger pain and carpal tunnel syndrome symptoms. I have a Gary Swallow slide that he customized with a rounded nose on one end and sharp edge on the other. I LOVE that thing! Easy to hold, comfortable, and I can maneuver it around faster than a bottleneck on my finger!

Thanks again guys, will order up some cd's and get started. Ricochet, is the bottle neck slide done on a Dobro, or resonator guitar? Is it easy enough to learn? Will try that also, have always loved the sound of both steel and dobro, just looking for the quickest way to actually play something that sounds like actual music, something that will allow me to jump right in and make music, and give me a little confidence, which is very important to me since it all seems so overwhelming to me. Thanks!

You can do bottleneck sliding on any guitar. It's a favorite style for playing resonator guitars, though they certainly don't have to be played with a slide, either. Bottleneck sliding on electric guitars was very popular in blues and what's now called "classic rock." My teacher used to grab random new guitars off the store shelves to play with me at lessons, but it's easier (especially when you're learning) if the strings are heavier than usual these days and the action's a little bit high.

Hey, along the lines of what we were just discussing, here's a scanned page from the 1966 Fender catalog on guitar strings:
http://www.classicamplifiers.com/1966FenderCatalog35.htm

Interesting to note that their only listed 6-string "Hawaiian Guitar" tuning was the old standard A Major, a.k.a. Open A. That was the usual lap steel tuning in the early days, so much so that many lesson books with tab didn't even mention the tuning. And the string gauges were .016-.055", almost the same as the Martin Bluegrass Resonator strings I mentioned, which are .016-.056" nickel wound strings intended for bluegrass dobros in the GBDGBD "High Bass G" Hawaiian tuning, but they're excellent for electric guitars as well. (I like the bright sound of nickel electric guitar strings on acoustic resonator guitars, too.)

The reason that Fender catalog was referenced just now on another board was a discussion about what kinds of strings Strats came with new in the '50s. The usual were .013-.054", and in the '60s they'd just come out with "light gauge rock and roll" strings, .010-.038".
http://www.classicamplifiers.com/1966FenderCatalog36.htm