Dumping the multieffects for single pedals: Boss vs. others

Hiya,

The feedback I get is that Boss are way ahead of the rest of the market.

Roland, though, have been in the sound synthesis game for many years, so I figure they can't be that bad - look how many bands use Roland keyboards.

I'd be tempted to take my guitar down to the local shop and try out a few single-effect pedals so that I could form an opinion. I've got a couple of single-effect pedals, but I'd like to have a multi; and one of my students recently bought a multi effects with amp modeller board (can't remember which make) so there's a case to be made both ways.

Best,

A :-)

I've just gotten back into guitars after about a 20 year period where I didn't play. (Yes, I'm old)

Needless to say a lot has happened since I was into playing. I'm facinated by the amp modeling technology and I have a Korg Ampworks and a Line 6 Guitar Port. Although I'm nowhere near ready to gig (other than in my bedroom) I think I would still prefer the simplicity of seperate pedals for seperate functions in a live situation. If your all-in-one box ever fails you during a gig, you'll be without everything unless you have another one on standby. If an individual pedal fails, it't just one effect that you can probablly survive with untill you replace it.

I don't have any experience with Boss pedals but I did buy a new pedal recently that I think is great. It's a Danelectro Wasabi AX-1 distortion (the black one, not to be confused with the Wasabi overdrive)

Here is the lowdown on it:

It has a heavy metal case, really cool styling and has lighed indicators (that look like tail lights) for each foot switch. There is one foot switch for boost and one for distortion. The boost is adjustable to either 5db or 10db gain. There is a switch for either single coil or humbucker input, The distortion has a 4 position eq switch, bass and treble, mix (clean signal vs distorted), distortion and level. As a kind of bonus there is a top secret switch inside the battery compartment that adds a bit of slapback echo (non-adjustable, either on or off) when the distortion is switched on.

Larry

Great responses so far. Alan, if you get a chance it would be great to hear your reports about single pedals. I've never owned anything but two multieffects boxes so I don't know anything about single pedals. But the other guitarist in the band wants me to just get a nice $700 amp and just use the effects on it to produce my sound. I'm thinking floor pedals are good to have or a multieffect box. Just trying to find out how others produce their sounds.

The biggest problem with using many individual pedals is that you end up with more noise and certain problems with level-matching. A multi-effects unit will be quieter and less quirky.

However, it is pretty much agreed that a single pedal will do that one thing better than most multis. And different brands do different things well, so it's nice to mix and match.

So if you just want one good distortion pedal, go for it. But if you run 6-7 pedals in-line, be aware of the trade-offs.

-Laz

Well, I'll chime in. I love Boss pedals. I have way too much equipment for this guitar hobby, but I will swear by Boss products. I usually play either a Gib LP or a Fender Strat these days. Main amp is a Flex III+, bedroom amp is a Micro Cube. But I still run clean on either with a Boss box when I want a certain sound. I have 2 distortion boxes, a phase shifter, an acoustic simulator and a chromatic tuner from Boss. I dare say you would have to try to kill it on purpose. My oldest one is over 20 yrs old and works like new. They do go through batteries though. I would suggest the "spider cable" if you get one like the tuner that has the pass through for it. You can get a radio shack cheapy adapter too if you want ... the Boss adapter is a bit more $$ ; )

Quote "Would you say Boss Pedals, in general, are of higher quality or have better sound than most others?"

My opinion, No. There are many effects companies that have equal or better effects and getting better everyday as technology moves forward and guitar players are moving back to older effects. boss has been around for sometime and have spent tons of money on advertising to market their products. Don't get me wrong they do make great equipment. It's a big ocean and plenty of fish in the sea.

Question. What sound and tone are you looking to create?

I know this sounds like a broken record, All tube amp first, effects second.

Joe

Boss does make very well built and durable pedals. That is their strongpoint. I don't think they sound any better than other makes.

I have used multi-effects processors and single effects live. I like the wide variety of effects you can get with the processors, but setting them up so they work well live is a lot of work. Every preset seems to have a different volume, and nearly all have to be tweaked down to sound good live. Every unit I've tried there is a delay when you switch from one preset to another. I hate that.

Single effects are simpler and kick in the moment you step on them. They tend to sound better (to me).

A downside of single effects is you have to turn one off and another on quickly many times. This is especially difficult if you are singing and don't want to come off the mic. At least with the multi-effects you can just step once to go to another preset. So there are pros and cons to each.

I have just gotten to the point where I try to get a great tone from my amp. I use the amps clean and drive channel to get a nice overdrive. I have a Danelectro Fab Tone for modern distortion. That's about all I'm using now. I do want to get a Danelectro Daddy-O.

Effects are nice, but they are a pain-in-the-A!

It's great so far we are getting both sides of the single/multi debate and seeing if Boss is a top product. Joe, as far as tone, I play clean most of the time but dirty up on songs like “Rockin' in the Free world” and others. I seldom get whacked out distortion unless I'm just screwing about but never in a situation when I play with others. I like chorus, reverb, sometimes delay, overdrive's soft crunch, and occasional distortion.

One thing I do like about my VG-88 multieffects board is there is zero delay between patches and was another point in buying it. With my RP300, there is a very noticeable gap when switching. I was playing with it last night and can hear a big difference in quality of sounds with the VG-88.

Joe, since you are one of the premier players here could you let us know what pedals/boards you use. I'd have to figure you only use what makes you sound best. Also, others out there tell us what you're using and why. Kinda like “I use X overdrive pedal because it's the best I found for my style and (low, medium, high) budget.”

I've got a couple of effects setups I use...

"Vintage": Maestro Fuzztain + Ross (no that's not a typo) analog chorus. I've had both of these pedals since 1972, and the best way to describe the sound is, well . . . unique. The Fuzztain has three settings: "Sustain" - analog compression, "Soft" - compression + soft clip OD, and "Hard" - compression + hard clip fuzztone. It also has "Drive" and "Volume" controls that are side mounted and large enough to easily adjust with your foot. To say the least you get some really unique sounds with the drive cranked to the point where the compressor stage is one the verge of overloading ;)

My newest pedalboard is the Vox Tonelab SE. I'm still learning it, but so far I'm finding out the folks at Vox put a LOT of time into making this a unit that's easy to work with, plus versatile enough to use with just about any live application. You can use it with presets, or just like a buncha stompboxes, or both at the same time. I can't wait to get this one on the road and see how she handles the shakedown.

Well thats a difficult call because I like anything I can plug my guitar into on my Quest for something different. the main most sought after is the overdriven or distorted amplifier sound which can be used in every style of music. It's that finding the right amount of overdrive/distortion that accentuate the chords, riff's, solo's, etc. A smooth warm sound of clean all tube amp can turn into a overdrive sound just by overpowering with volume and high output pickups.

Lets look back on one of the grand dad of of overdriving tube amp, none other than Chuck berry, which he got just by turning the volume on the amps beyond what most other guitarist did in those day. Most of those amps weren't high watt amps. Some even went as far as cutting slits in the speakers.

The trick is finding the right sound for a particular style of music and this is important to every guitarist. Being that over the course of listening to all styles of music we associate certain guitar tones to certain style. It's when you break out of the normal thinking that will set you apart from the rest. This takes experimentation and practice with the sound or tone and getting your guitar to talk.

The thing to do when listening to other guitarist is to try and adjust your guitar, effects, and amp to their sound or tone. Listen for any effects if any that their using. The more you work imitating what you hear the easier it will become. which goes without saying just because you have stockpiles of equipment that have harmonizers, delays, tube screamers, exciters, and other effects doesn't mean you need to use them all the time.

Sometimes the best use of an effect is not to use it. Now that said and taking the the long road around. I mainly use the combination of both single pedals, rack mount, and all tube amplifiers.

With that VG-88 you should be able create anything and everything, it will take time to adjust. This is were I was talking about when your listening to a song and you go wow I like the sound of that guitar, then you set down and go through the presets till you find on that is really close, then copy it to a blank user patch and tweak the parameters till it sounds the way you like it.

The trick is to move a rhythm patch and matching lead patch next to each other or set the patch so you can individually set different switches to turn an effect on or off. That will eliminate the real time lag between switching.

I think I'll end for now on that note before some say I'm writing a articule..lol

Joe

Hi. I have (had) two Boss Effects both were bought in the 80s.
One was a Roland Boss Wah wah with a three way tone switch.
It died (batteries leaked into it) anyways it wasn't all that anyways.
the three way was a lame gimmick. You could get the same range on
a cry baby with just one motion.
On the other hand, I got a boss Phaser that totally rules. If I can
find it lol. that thing coud be run over by a truck and still keep
working.

If you wanted you could drop a bowling ball on the switch to turn it on and off! (yeah go ahead and try...) Honestly though it was made real sturdy and didn't have as much of a hiss noise like so many other makes did.

I'm wanting effects too but, I'm not sure what I want other than a chorus and to find my *&^$%!!! Phaser. :D

I think I'll end for now on that note before some say I'm writing a articule..lol

Joe

Hey Joe,

I know you're busy, but I'm sure I'm not the only one that wouldn't mind seeing a lengthy article of your thoughts and ideas and practical application on a subject like this. Just an idea.

This is not meant to trash multi-/multiple effects users, nor put everyone in the same category:

There's a trend I've noticed among guitarists who have played more than 15 or so years. Many who go through a phase of having and using lots of a pedals eventually "simplify" their setups as much as possible -- usually settling on a favorite amplifier and maybe one or two cherished effects -- maybe even no effects save their amp's reverb. I think one of the reasons this happens is that these players finally find a sound they like, and they really want to get down to playing instead of thinking about settings during jams and performances (studio is different). I'd also be willing to bet that a lot of that tonal epiphany is really a result of the player's developed skills in creating a much of that tone/style with his/her fingers and guitar. The right amp helps a lot, too.

Again, the above is a generalization, I know of exceptions -- from those who always played well with zero or one effect, to those who have built effects empires. And this applies to live playing, not the studio. For certain genres, there's no getting around heavily layered effects.

My view of multi-effect units is the time spent tweaking them is often wasted unless one has done so in the live, full band environment. When practicing alone or recording, layered effects often sound fantastic. It's not until one gets into a live situation, where the demand for dynamic control is much greater, that it becomes apparent that the cool sound just isn't popping through the mix. Cranking the amp just makes things too overpowering and the ability to back down with guitar volume or modulate by picking is useless -- effect compression, gating and/or distortion end up removing all of the touch dynamics from the signal feeding the amp. Multi-effects units make it more likely that this will occur as there is often significant amplitude compression, even in supposedly simple virtual effects chains.

My advice is to start simple. Begin with your guitar and amp and learn what they can do together with no external effects. There should be lots of tonal variety and dynamic range -- if not, you need a setup that has this, as the effects most people actually buy* aren't going to help. Then add effects to see how that changes. Master one or two effects at a time, and get to know the sounds these can produce with your amp and guitar(s). Make sure playing dynamics are preserved as much as possible, as this is an important aspect of live playing for most styles ... or at least make sure turning the volume control on your guitar does something, e.g., wall-of-sound medium versus wall-of-sound loud. Or better yet, something along that "clean to crunchy to brown to insane" scale. If multi-effects are your thing, understand what each processing option does. Learn how each effect affects playing dynamics and tone. If the dynamics are compromised, there's a good bet there will be some difficultly controling your volume in a band.

-Greg

* Nobody's first effects purchase is an equalizer.

Well said gnease.

Back in the day the only real effect we had going was turning those Gibson tube amps till you could feel the tone on the frets. Heck they were only small watt amps. and yes they weren't Old amps in those days..lol.. And your right about going back to basic's, lately I've been doing this more and more lately.

One anvil rack case, 2x12 cabinet, midi pedal, volume, wah and delay pedals, one small Gibson tube amp, attenuator, and four mic's. Simple and sweet.

The saying goes.."you need to learn to drive before you can speed"

Joe

Yes, I do love my layering of effects though.