First -time FX pedal buyer

Hi Vic, it's been awhile.

Well, we're all going crazy over Zoom on another thread.

I would recommend Zoom. They are quality built, have very good effects (in my opinion they have the best distortions bar none), and are super easy to edit. They are also very affordable. Zoom is just hard to beat overall.

Here's a page at Music 123 with just about all the various Zoom pedals. I would recommend the higher priced models like the GFX-1, GFX-3, or GFX-5 simply because they are made of metal. Extremely durable pedals. However, I have owned the plastic models before and never had a single problem with Zoom. They make quality gear.

I just found a page with hundreds of Zoom patch presets. Also, Joe put some of his favorites on that same thread. Check em out.

Zoom @ Music 123

One of the greatest features of Zoom IMHO is that they are super easy to edit. Basically you just turn the button to whatever effect you like, push a button up and down to you find what you like, and hit Store twice. Takes 30 seconds top. Some of the fancier higher priced effects you have to read a 70 page manual and still don't understand it. So I love the simplicity.

And they are good pedals.

I've never used a Zoom but the Boss GT-5/6's are not too pricey second hand and you might want to look into those as well.

FWIW, I'm going to cover some pros and cons on first timers buying/using lower cost multi-FX:

Pros

- Inexpensive on a $/effect basis

- Somewhat flexible and allows experimentation and introduction to a wide variety of effects.

- Simple to use, providing quick start out-of-the-box, especially given the pre-sets that allow an approximations of "classic" tones

- Quick, simple patch to patch changes without a lot of on-the-spot tweaking (I don't mean short delay patch to patch. That varies unit to unit and is something else entirely)

Cons

- Makes it difficult for many noobs to understand exactly what each individual effects stage does and how adjusting the various parameters of that one effect changes the tone and playing dynamics. Few patches are only one or two effects, but more typically are a complicated interaction between several.

- The order of effects processing in a multi-box is usually fixed. Good if one doesn't have a clue, but bad for experimentation and learning why the order matters.

- Limited precision and dimesions of adjustment on various processing parameters: Lower cost Multi-FX are compromise designs. There aren't many adjustment steps for each effect stage. Often it's effect-on, effect-off and one or two steps in between. Not too complicated, but not very subtle either. Similarly, limited processing precision in less expensive pedals => the more effects used, the nastier the results can sometimes be due to limitations of digital signal processing implemented on a low cost platform. All this is engineering-speak for "you get what you pay for" or similarly "no free lunch."

- Ends up being a bit of a crutch, so when one gets used to his/her multi-FX box and settings, but ends up on a different rig at a jam, we hear "Dude, I can't get my sound, I don't have my UltrasuperMFingZoomerUberBox. I'm gonna suck." Whereas, if one learns how "generic" FX work, one also learns to tweak and go even on foreign rigs.

******

After buying and owning numerous multi- and individual FX pedals and PODs and Zooms and Pandoras and ..., I've come to the conclusion that there is room for both types (really three types, if one counts high-end multis separately). However, if one is new to the game, and looking for a particular sound or effect -- say overdrive or chorus -- and really wants to learn to use it effectively (ha!, pun), I recommend looking into those overdrive or chorus pedals first, and spending the time at the store with some help to learn what is available that produces sounds close to what one likes. Buy it (or better, borrow from a friend), take it home and tweak and learn. If one has an extra $99, sure get a multi-FX pedal as well, but don't count on it being the end-all solution to tone. I'd much rather spend my $99 on one good, dedicated effect than a so-so, does-it-all -- especially if I'm trying to learn to use a particular effect for best results.

Understand that guys like Wes and Joe have been playing for long enough to have gone through the digital effects revolutions (bad and good) after having already learned how those first, primitive individual analog effects boxes worked and sounded. They approached Zoom boxes already knowing what these things should be able to do and what adjusting something exotic like compression will affect. First timers that grab and go with a multi may well miss a significant learning experience. Does it matter? Depends on one's personal goals in all this. YMMV.

-- Greg

Vic: looking at your 'demands' I see no reason at all why you should spend money on a multi-effects unit. With all respect to Zoom, Digitech and whatnot, a 100$ multi-effect will have a inferior distortion to a 60$ distortion pedal. Not too bad if you care for the other effects as well, but if all you need is a distortion switch then get a distortion pedal.

So, which one? Hard to say. If it is over a transistor amp, get a distortion pedal, if it is over a tube amp, get a booster. Boss, Digitech, Zoom, Fulltone and many others make dedicated boosters and distortion pedals for as little as $40 and as much as 300$ for tube-driven pedals. All of these pedals consist of a simple on/off switch and three or four knobs with gain, EQ and volume. Way easier then any multi-effect.

hmm....never thought of a multi FX pedal.....but it'd be nice if I could find one that switched from cllean to overdrive and a few other FX besides.... guess I'll just have to go and have a look in the guitar shop again!!!!

Thanks as always for the advice......

Vic

First of all, thanks to Greg for the compliment, but I don't think I understand effects any better than a lot of young kids just starting out. The young people today are pretty savvy! I learned more about the computer from my step-son when he was about 12 years old than any adult.

I own many individual pedals, and I've owned quite a few multi-effects. They both have pros and cons to me.

Single effects

Pros-

They usually are very good at whatever effect they are designed for. So you can get a great chorus, delay, etc.... And they are usually very tweakable (is that a real word?), so you can get the sound you like.

If a single unit breaks you just take it out of the chain. All your other effects are still working.

You can place effects in any order you choose.

Cons-

While a single effect is great at whatever it produces, say distortion, it also only produces one effect. What I mean is, if you buy a Metal distortion pedal, it is often hard to get any type of distortion except a Metal sound. You can't always get a Blues overdrive for instance. Of course, this varies from pedal to pedal.

They are more expensive.

They take up more room.

Each pedal usually needs it's own power supply.

But to me, the biggest con to individual pedals is this, especially in a live situation; Let's say you are playing clean guitar and you want just a little chorus effect. Fine, you step on the pedal. Now, when it comes to the chorus you want distortion without chorus but a little delay. What do you do? You start dancing!! You quickly tap chorus off, jump over and tap delay on, and then jump to distortion and tap it on. Man, sometimes I felt like Fred Astaire! And if you are singing and on a mic this is really tough.
Then when you go back to the verse you have to tap dance again. To me, this is the greatest disadvantage to individual pedals.

Multi-effects Pedals

Pros

You get many distortions and effects for a low price. You can get Metal distortions, Blues overdrive.....

You can select which effects go on which patch. No more tap dancing. So, you have one patch with a clean sound and chorus and another with distortion and delay. You make one single tap to change patches. I love this.

One power source. This is a great feature.

Cons

Effects are not always as great a quality as individual pedals. Also, effects cannot usually be tweaked as well as single pedals.

If your unit goes down, you lose every effect.

You cannot usually select the order of effects.

My 2 cents.

Wes

To add to Wes' posts:

The cons of MFX he described are indeed true for the cheaper units. For example, my GX700 multi-effect by Boss (costs around $100 used or so, so not that expensive) allows you to link effects in whatever order you like, has FAR more parameters then any analog pedal and can be tweaked with much greater accuracy. Sound quality of individual pedals is for some effects still better, but more expensive multi-effects solve this problem as well. If you're interested in 19" effects for in the studio, take a look at the Behringer DSP2024 (around $100) or the TC Electronics G-major (around $500). You need a MIDI floorboard if you want to switch while playing, so not really the easiest and cheapest way if you play live a lot, but great for home recordings.

If you're going to use multiple effects with a band, a proper multi-effect is the only way to go. If you only need one or two effects (like SRV for example) just get one or two pedals.

The first effects pedal I bought was the Digitech RP200. A fantastic little multi effects piece of kit with expression pedal to change the pitch of the wah effects and also to act as volume pedal. It has 40 or so presets and 40 more channels for your own presets. Some of the other things I like about it are , Great acoustic emulation, the best Swell effect I've ever heard, about 30 different drum rythmn patterns where you can adjust the tempo, a headphone socket so you can use it without it being plugged into your amp and still get great volume and tone. There is also a website where you can get the info on how to create your presets to match those sounds of your favourite artists ( and they are very very close).
No, I dont work for Digitech. I just think that the RP 200 is superb.
You will always find them on E-bay because guitarists the world over change their kit, always looking for something that doesnt exist, something better than the last piece of kit they bought, when in truth they had exactly what they wanted all the time.

You could always go for the cheaper end, like the RP50 or RP100 but you dont get the expression with these two and if you go for the latest one which is the RP200A, the (A) refering to artist then you get something that is already set to make you sound like Knopfler, Santana, Hendrix, SRV, etc. etc. etc.

I know a lot have people have been saying Zoom is fantastic. and yes I agree with that, they do have great effects but you pick up something made by Zoom and then pick up something made by Digitech and then tell me which you think is made to last.

anyway thats my 5 cents worth. I'll leave you this link and let you make your own mind up.

http://www.digitech.com/

To add to Wes' posts:

The cons of MFX he described are indeed true for the cheaper units. For example, my GX700 multi-effect by Boss (costs around $100 used or so, so not that expensive) allows you to link effects in whatever order you like, has FAR more parameters then any analog pedal and can be tweaked with much greater accuracy. Sound quality of individual pedals is for some effects still better, but more expensive multi-effects solve this problem as well. If you're interested in 19" effects for in the studio, take a look at the Behringer DSP2024 (around $100) or the TC Electronics G-major (around $500). You need a MIDI floorboard if you want to switch while playing, so not really the easiest and cheapest way if you play live a lot, but great for home recordings.

If you're going to use multiple effects with a band, a proper multi-effect is the only way to go. If you only need one or two effects (like SRV for example) just get one or two pedals.

My post was directed at cheaper units (as clearly stated). The GX700 may be cheap as a used unit, but it was a fairly pricy piece when new, and is still esteemed by many. Cheapo Zoom pedals? Well, they've probably improved, but I was so disgusted by the sound quality of the only one I've ever owned, I gave it away to somebody I barely knew who happened to show some interested in it. Have never regreted or missed it. OTOH, I have regreted selling a number of quality analog pedals, such as a classic MXR DynaComp.

I think the best and most practical use of a broad-spectrum multi-FX unit of almost any type is for playing covers tunes. (Same goes for the Variax, BTW.) However, FX alone will not make someone sound like their fave artist. As noted in other topics/forums, most of that sound comes directly from the player. I think a lot of those multi-FX units that appear on eBay are there because the owner finally realized the unit wouldn't instantly make them sound like the fave artist, and/or they reached the conclusion that the first place to start a tone quest is at the amp.

I will cop to owning and liking one multi-FX pedal for live playing: the Line6 DL-4 delay modeler -- best $250 bucks I've ever spent on a pedal. But hey, it only does delays ... really, really well.

Alrigh i have recently made post about effects.My first fx thing was a zoom, it was ok. I got away from all the fake sound and played on a v-amp(it blew me away) so i bought it. I then decided that most stuff i play(classic rock like zep,ac/dc, aersosmith, g&r) has distortion alot. So bough a pro co turbo rat. I did look into the mxr distortion which sounds great and is cheaper. Hoiwever i felt i had more control over the turbo rat and it still had a great sound. I then tried putting the distortion pedal w/ the v-amp, and they just don't go together. I even tried the zoom with it. I talk to many guitarist (in bands) and they told me go with the single effects and start it off and just build up your board)My effects are

-digitech x series digidelay- it has got up to 4 seconds of delay and has 7 econd loop memory that you can overdub a ton)

-Turbo Rat-awesome pedal

-Jim Dunlop 535 Q Wah Wah Pedal-so many options

-Rocktron Banshee Talkbox- This is the funiest thing

-dod envelope filter-Great Jerry Garcia sound so many options great for funk, from what i hear flea and bootsy collins use this

Anyway I am so glad i went the slower more expensve way. IT WILL HELPFUL IN THE LONG RUN. and as some one alreay mentioned chorus is a great sound while playing clean,may i recommend mxr cause they sometimes have the smaller stompboxes that worked great.

So tell me Hotrod, what exactly is the helpfull part of the individual pedal way? The more expensive MFX units can be tweaked better, linked easier, switched faster (and even together with your amp using one single MIDI setup!), need only a single powersupply, contain effects that are not availlable in individual parameters, don't require a billion cables and their loss of sound quality etc etc.

The advantages of pedals? Easier to use, and less expensive in the beginning. You tell me which one is better in the long run...

Had a look at the Zoom site.....look very reasonable price-wise....suppose the only way I'll find out for sure is to go and check them out....ah well, gives me an excuse for a day out.....

Vic

Vic,
I'm very naive about pedals, but I've had a good amount of fun with my Zoom pedal for a year or so. I think they're a good deal for the price.
Tim

I've had the one they sent me for 10 or 11 years now. When I first got I took everywhere it saw some abuse of the road. Thats why they asked me to work with it. The last few years it's only seen limited use. It still works great I turned it on the other day to write down the presets for another question, so I played on it for awhile. Still sounds great. With as much equipment as I have it's hard to play with it all.

That zoom 505 out lived the two amps another company sent right around the same time. but then I pushed the amps to hard running 4x12 cabinets with them..lol Have to admit the little 15 watt Crates did hold their own, each running a 4x12.

Both the Zoom and Crates are worthy investments. I'm just harder on equiment than most, thats what testing is about. taking things beyond normal use. Mainly because of the duration of time I have them on and playing throught them. Like days at a time without turning them off.

Joe