This thread by slej in Opinions and Polls really got me thinking about the role of the bassist in a band:
http://forums.guitarnoise.com/viewtopic.php?t=26270
Like I posted in that thread, it must've been a little tough to be the bass player with Moon as the drummer. Sort of like playing along with a psychotic metronome or something ;)
It's almost as if the Ox was the only person keeping time, working to hold the pieces together - not that Moon or Townsend were off the beat or anything; it just seems that Entwistle was playing the 'pulse' of any given song; not the actual beats, since the beats were lots of times filled to the top of Moon's fills. Any lesser drummer would've come out sideways and slid into a trainwreck with those kinds of fills, but Moon always seemed to be able to come back in on the One.
Looking at him (Ox) playing, it almost looks as though (aside from him knowing the song inside-out), he's thinking "ONE...explosions, crashes, fills-AND-AH, ONE" rather than mentally counting it all out; almost as if to play with Moon, you'd have to ignore most of everything else and just focus on the main passage of measures rather than actual beats and backbeats.
And on this video you can really hear how relaxed his playing and his basslines actually sound; as though he comes in on the beat with Moonie, but then 'breathes out' so to speak, doing a nice long phrase while Moon fills every available space possible with rolls and fills, then hits the downbeat again.
It's such an interesting interaction between drummer and bassist. I wonder who Pete was cueing more on - Entwhistle or Moon?
But it is interesting to see how different the role is for the Ox compared to the role of other bassists in other bands. :)
Good commentary.
I found this on wikipedia, which adds some additional flavor to what you're saying:
Pete Townshend was often quoted that it was Entwistle who was the lead guitarist in the band, while he, being the rhythmic timekeeping element, was in effect the drummer. Moon, on the other hand, with all his flourishes round the kit, was considered by Townshend to be the equivalent of a keyboard player. Entwistle himself stated in many interviews (including one with Guitar Player's Chris Jisi in 1989) that, according to modern standards, "The Who haven't a proper bass player."
"Everybody got to elevate from the norm."
Funny, really - I always considered John to be such a good bass player, he seemed to fill in for the rhythm guitarist as well - since I've been playing bass, there's a lot of bass-lines I can copy and play note-for-note, but it's damned hard work trying to copy the Ox - he's so BUSY!!!!
Strange when you think Daltrey was originally the lead guitarist with the High Numbers - PT said he played guitar like a banjo, but badly - if you listen to some of Rog's solo stuff from about '73 - The "Ride A Rock Horse" album was pretty good, the "Giving It All Away" single was fabulous - wonder why Rog never played rhythm or acoustic on stage with the Who? He could play.....
The Who and Led Zep were very close, musically speaking - a singer who just sang, a guitarist who played lead AND rhythm, a great bass player who filled in on other instruments, and possibly the finest pair of drummers who ever lived - not much to choose between the Loon and Bonzo.....
:D :D :D
Vic
"Sometimes the beauty of music can help us all find strength to deal with all the curves life can throw us." (D. Hodge.)
Hey, forgot about this thread!
I didn't know Daltry was a lead guy, but...I think I saw him on some Who video (Kids?) where he's strumming an electric of some sort.
No, that might've been Jagger playing a Tele onstage with the boys.
Daltry might've been into Ethnomusic (world music now) earlier than a lot of us, using his mic and cable like an Australian bull-roarer ;)
Not a good fellow to hang a guitar on with that thing whirling around. :)
You're right about Moonie and Bonzo; those must've been hard drummers to be the bassist with/for. Well maybe not Bonz because he was like intricately-timed thunder; Moon was more like four thunderstorms going off at the same time. Would'a been hard maybe, but an amazing experience. JP Jones and the Ox; two totally different styles, but they meshed.
And then there's Noel Redding (playing Hendrix written parts) playing with what amounts to be a jazz/swing drummer Mitch Mitchell
