Skip to content
describing scale de...
 
Notifications
Clear all

describing scale degrees in major & minor

5 Posts
3 Users
0 Likes
1,713 Views
(@patrick)
Reputable Member
Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 138
Topic starter  

Say I'm in B minor and the main progression is based on B - A - G - A. Should this be described as 1 - 7 - 6 - 7 (which is its descrition based in the B minor scale), or should it be described as 1 - b7 - b6 - b7 (which is its description based on the B major scale) ? Or is either descrition correct as long as you specify which scale the description is based on? Thanks.


   
Quote
(@fretsource)
Prominent Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 973
 

Assuming your first chord is B minor, not major, the standard method would be to label that sequence using Roman numerals as:

i - VII - VI - VII

Unlike with chord construction, chords on minor scale degrees aren't labeled relative to the major scale - but the various forms of the minor scale. Whether a particular chord is built on the natural, harmonic or melodic forms of the scale can be deduced by the use of upper case or lower case or by the addition of a diminished or augmented symbol.

Your VII chord occurs only on the seventh degree of the natural minor scale. If it occurred on the raised seventh degree of the harmonic minor scale, it would be shown as lower case vii plus a diminished symbol, (which I can't quite remember how to write at the moment :lol: )

However, you'll find a significant amount of variation in actual usage - I also tend to write bVII. Usually it's not a problem as common sense says it doesn't mean "double flatted".


   
ReplyQuote
(@kingpatzer)
Noble Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 2171
 

Say I'm in B minor and the main progression is based on B - A - G - A. Should this be described as 1 - 7 - 6 - 7 (which is its descrition based in the B minor scale), or should it be described as 1 - b7 - b6 - b7 (which is its description based on the B major scale) ? Or is either descrition correct as long as you specify which scale the description is based on? Thanks.

If you're using the natural minor scale, then you'd either describe it as the i-VII-VI-VII OR as the vi-V-VI-V of the D Major scale (B minor's related major)

The deciding factor would probably be made based on extentions and the melody.

Do you play the A as a A7? If so, then it's most likely functioning as a V7.
Even if you don't play the A7 as a V7 does an G appear in the melody of that measure as more than a passing tone? In either of those cases, you're most likely in D (or some mode thereof).

Also, look at the rest of the melody? What's the tonal center there? If it's a D, then B is probably acting as a I chord (vi and I chords are pretty interchangeable!) and the key is really D major.

If you're using a scale other than the natural minor scale (the harmonic or melodic minor scales for example) then the extentions on the chords would be very different, and you'd describe in terms of the B-minor progression.

If the tonal center is B, you're not playing G's under that A chord, then you're most likely in B-minor and you'd describe the progression from that perspective.

When describing progressions, use capital roman numerals for major chords, and lower case roman numerals for minor chords.

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
ReplyQuote
(@fretsource)
Prominent Member
Joined: 18 years ago
Posts: 973
 

Hold on there KP - He's already told us that the key is B minor, so we can discount any analysis based on the relative major D.

He wants to know specifically how to analyse it in B minor using chords Bm A and G
A is major so it must be upper case VII, from which we can deduce it is built on the natural minor's seventh degree, i.e A, rather than A#
G is also major so must also be upper case VI. We can deduce it is built on the natural or harmonic minor's sixth degree, rather than the raised sixth degree of the melodic minor, (G#).

Edit - Ah - You've changed it :lol:


   
ReplyQuote
(@kingpatzer)
Noble Member
Joined: 19 years ago
Posts: 2171
 

yeah, I was being sloppy, so I went back and fixed my rapid initial response.. sorry for the confussion :)

"The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side." -- HST


   
ReplyQuote