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Question about modes?

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(@nousername)
New Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 2
Topic starter  

I fail to see the difference between for example, D dorian and C major, except starting former on D note.

I will take "So What" by Miles Davis as an example. I took a look on bass line of the song and it doesn't start on D note, but rather ends on it. After this part, a Em7-Dm7 vamp is played. Can someone please explain me how does this make this song D dorian?


   
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(@alangreen)
Member
Joined: 22 years ago
Posts: 5342
 

Start by listening to the sound of each. The order of tone and semitone steps is different so the two scales sound very different.

C Major - TTSTTTS

D Dorian - TSTTTST

Modes are determined by the Final - your melody might not start on D but it will finish on it.

However, in the vamp, you do have a D - in the Em7, so that part of your tune does begin and end with the Final. You could play a single note of D over both chords, and the dissonant D against the E in the Em7 would then resolve against the D in the Dm7.

Don't overthink it when it comes to Modes.

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(@noteboat)
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Joined: 21 years ago
Posts: 4921
 

Most melodies don't begin on the tonic, or key note - sing "Happy Birthday" in the key of C and you're starting on a G. But most melodies will end on the tonic, because that's the tone that will make the melody sound complete - so you'll find Happy Birthday does end on a C.

It's the relationship of the other sounds to that tonic that create the scale. If you want to understand the difference between C major and D Dorian, don't compare the two directly, because they have different tonic notes. Instead, compare D Dorian to D major:

D-E-F-G-A-B-C-D
D-E-F#-G-A-B-C#-D

or compare C major to C Dorian:

C-D-E-F-G-A-B-C
C-D-Eb-F-G-A-Bb-C

Now you can see that even though C major and D Dorian both have the same notes, the relationships are different. The major scale includes a tone a major third above the tonic, and another tone a minor second below the tonic (the 3rd and 7th notes of the scale). The Dorian doesn't have either of those tones in relation to the tonic - instead, it has one a minor third above the tonic (the b3 of the major scale with the same key note) and another a major 2nd below the tonic (the b7 of the major scale).

See the difference?

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(@notes_norton)
Noble Member
Joined: 16 years ago
Posts: 1497
 

To further illustrate what Note Boat said:

A minor is the Aeolian mode to C Major (Ionian mode) - and they don't sound the same either.

So the better comparison is from C Ionian to C Aeolian

C-D-E-F-G-A-B-C = C Major/Ionian
C-D-Eb-F-G-Ab-Bb-C = C Minor/Aeolian
C-D-Eb-F-G-A-Bb-C = C Dorian (and you can see why Dorian sounds dark like Aeolian/Minor)

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(@nousername)
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Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 2
Topic starter  

I think i can understand it now. Thanks a lot guys.


   
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