what is a turn around chord??

It's usually referred to as "a turnaround" if I'm understanding your question correctly. It's the set of chords at the end of a 12 bar (or other bar-length) blues prgoression. So, in the key of E, you have this 12-bar progression:

|E|E|E|E|
|A|A|E|E|
|B|A|E|B|

The bit I've put in bold is what would be referred to as "the turnaround" as that's the set of chords which take you from the end of the 'progression' (all twelve bars) back to the start (first line).

To go into a little more detail as to the "why" behind it, I'll switch to the key of C, since that's the easiest one to explain this by.

So, the key of C would have the following blues progression....

|C|C|C|C|
|F|F|C|C|
|G|F|C|G|

(Bold bit is the turnaround)

The scale of C major contains the following notes....

C,D,E,F,G,A,B,C,

and you can derive chords from this scale basically by taking any note, then putting with it the second note above your chosen note, and the note that is four places above your first note. (I say basically, since I'm not sure how this holds for all scales, I still gotta lotta learning to do, lol).

So, with scale of C, you have the following chords......

(I) C major (CEG)
(ii)Dminor (DFA)
(iii)Eminor(EGB)
(IV)F major (FAC)
(V)Gmajor(GBD)
(vii)Aminor(ACE)
(viii)Bdiminished (BDF)

thats seven chords, that I've indicated the order of using Roman Numerals. This is pretty standard in music - since a C major scale has the same structural sequence of notes (i.e. Tone-Tone-Semitone-Tone-Tone-Tone-Semitone) as any other major scale, using roman numerals makes it easier to transpose music and to analyse music when dealing with one or more pieces. Any conclusions we draw from our study, we can then easily apply to more than one key.

So, we can rewrite the 12-bar blues structure as this.....

|i|i|i|i|
|IV|IV|i|i|
|V|IV|i|V|

(I've used a small "i" here simply to differentiate between the bar lines - | - and the chords - i - but you'd normally write the "i" as "I" as I did in the chord listing above....you use capitals for major chords, and small case for minors).

The turnaround is, once again, in bold.

Now that we've got a universal structure for the tune (the roman numerals bit), we can look more closely at what's going on. The 'turnaround', as noted earlier, functions to take us from the end of the progression back to the start. It performs this function via a perfect cadence.

A perfect cadence is, quite simply, a V-I chord progression. The perfect cadence in this example being the V of bar 12 resolving to the I of bar 1 (or bar 13, if you''d prefer).

But the cadence doesn't just 'resolve' back to chord I by magic/luck/whatever. There's something about the notes involved which creates this sense of resolution.

Going back to our chords, in the key of C, a V-I progression (or perfect cadence) would be G-C.

The notes of each of those chords is thus.....

Gmajor (GBD) Cmajor (CEG)

Each chords shares one note, the G. So the transition from the Gmajor to the Cmajor is smooth for that note - it doesn't change at all.
Looking at the remaining notes.........we have a B in our Gmajor, that could easily slide up to the C note in our Cmajor chord, they're right next to each other on the fretboard. Likewise, the D note in our Gmajor could easily slide up to the E note in our Cmajor, or down to the C note in our Cmajor - the D note is one fret away from the e and one fret away from the C. Again, its a smooth transition.

And that is what makes the perfect cadence function as a perfect cadence. The notes in our chord V (Gmajor) easily move to become the notes of our chord I (Cmajor). Its a trick that has featured in western music for hundreds of years, if not longer. And, as we've gotten used to hearing it more and more, that reinforces the sense of resolution -we're accustomed to it happening. So much so that you were unsure of what a 'turnaround' is - its become pretty ingrained in our listening, so we both notice it and don't notice it, if that makes sense to you.

Apologies if this sounds at all condescending/patronising, but I'm guessing that's what you were wanting to know about, and I figured if I assumed no knowledge, then what I wrote should (I hope) be clear enough for you to digest.

Edit: I was gonna add a bit on 7th chords, but I couldn't formulate it succintly enough (insomnia isn't greatly compatbile with music theory, lol). I might repost later, if I can find a decent way of saying it. But hopefully this will have at least partly answered your question.

I really wish my old muic teachers were GN members, if only so they'd see that some of the stuff they taught me did actually sink in. Shame one plays piano and the other plays the oboe. :roll:

many thanks again, that does make perfect sense. like you said, it must be ingrained in my brain as after analysing the chord progressions of some of my songs, i see i have used this type of progression myself without realising. anyway, thanks again, Al

no probs, its actually a pleasure to be able to pass this kind of knowledge on to others. as my second post attests, I wasn't always comfortable with theory (I'm still not totally comfortable, but I can dip my big toe in nowadays without fear of sharks ripping it off :wink: )

And I really should issue my own thanks to Noteboat, Fretsource, and a few others on this site. Reading how they explained stuff I understand to others has given me a 'blueprint' for want of a better term to answer these queries myself. Props for that guys. :D

And I really should issue my own thanks to Noteboat, Fretsource, and a few others on this site. Reading how they explained stuff I understand to others has given me a 'blueprint' for want of a better term to answer these queries myself. Props for that guys. :D

Very nice of you to say so, Scrybe. :D It's a great feeling to know I've played a small part in helping you write such informative and well-presented posts as the one above, or others of yours that I've enjoyed reading. Cheers!

:D

Then I know you'll be more inclined to answer some of my questions, as soon as I find something else to thoroughly confuse myself with..... :wink: j/p

Sara

Sara, ya done good :)

Only one small point... a V-I or V-i is called an "authentic" cadence. A "perfect" cadence is one in which the last chord (the I/i) is voiced with the root in both the bass and soprano voices.

So V-I can be a perfect authentic cadence, or an imperfect authentic cadence. And a IV-I (or any other cadence) can also be perfect.

Other than that, your explanation was excellent!

lol, yeah I noticed the use of 'authentic cadence' in one of your articles on here, Tom. I just reverted back to using 'perfect cadence' out of habit, lol.......perfect, imperfect, plagal were the three distinctions I had to learn, but I'm aware it isn't as clear cut than that. Cheers for the clarification. :D

Now, who do I see about that gold star? :lol:

Unfortunately cadences are a minefield of inconsistency as far as naming them goes. Over on this side of the pond, any V-I (V-i) cadence is a perfect cadence, the 'most perfect' of which is the one that Noteboat called the perfect authentic cadence. (not a term we see much round these parts). There are other (rarer) terms around to qualify the less-than-perfect ones such as inverted perfect cadence or semi-perfect cadence, but they're all classed as types of perfect cadence. The obvious term "imperfect cadence" is avoided, as it's already in use to mean a phrase that ends with chord V, what Americans call the 'half close', I think.

The scale of C major contains the following notes....

C,D,E,F,G,A,B,C,

and you can derive chords from this scale basically by taking any note, then putting with it the second note above your chosen note, and the note that is four places above your first note. (I say basically, since I'm not sure how this holds for all scales, I still gotta lotta learning to do, lol).

So, with scale of C, you have the following chords......

(I) C major (CEG)
(ii)Dminor (DFA)
(iii)Eminor(EGB)
(IV)F major (FAC)
(V)Gmajor(GBD)
(vii)Aminor(ACE)
(viii)Bdiminished (BDF)

For years, I've wondered why the chords should be major/minor/minor/major/major/minor/dim......because of the way you laid the info out, it's like someone flicked a light switch on.....all is clear!!!!

Thank you, Sara!

:D :D :D

Vic

Unfortunately cadences are a minefield of inconsistency as far as naming them goes. Over on this side of the pond, any V-I (V-i) cadence is a perfect cadence, the 'most perfect' of which is the one that Noteboat called the perfect authentic cadence. (not a term we see much round these parts). There are other (rarer) terms around to qualify the less-than-perfect ones such as inverted perfect cadence or semi-perfect cadence, but they're all classed as types of perfect cadence. The obvious term "imperfect cadence" is avoided, as it's already in use to mean a phrase that ends with chord V, what Americans call the 'half close', I think.

Well, since I only knew three cadence names, learning these variations is kewl, I'll just have to figure out the US-UK translations as well, lol.

TBH, I have to do a mental translate whenever I read posts saying thing like "oh its all 16th notes...." - I'm still stuck with crochets, minims, quavers, etc, etc. And what's with 'measures' and 'bars'? Last time I checked, no one ever says "lets do a 12 measure in E!" :? :lol: :wink:

Vic, glad it made sense to ya.

Edit: Forget the gold star.....I've just realised I'm now a 'senior member' - Who do I see about my free bus pass?!? :lol: :lol:

Why is it B diminished?

Why is it B diminished?
If you look here, you'll see a table showing how the various chords come together. I think that a picture is often better than 1000 words.

Here are a table that some people have found useful:
Notes by scale degree Notes by name (in C)
1_2_34_5_6_78 C_D_EF_G_A_B_C Chord no Chord name
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
1___3__5 C___E__G I C major
2__4___6 D__F___A ii D minor
3__5___7 E__G___B iii E minor
4___6__8 F___A__C IV F major
5___7__9 G___B__D V G major
6__8___10 A__C___E vi A minor
7__9__11 B__D__F vii° B diminished