This is pretty much a rhetorical question for anyone to think about who feels held back and making no progress. I'm sure thinking about it after last night. Why last night? I decided my playlist/songbook was getting out of control. It needed to be weeded out (again). At one point it was over 90 sheets. This is just a couple of loose leaf binders, not to mention a bunch of fake books (OK, there are a lot of duplicates).
There were so many songs because every time I thought of a song I liked, I wanted to learn to play it. I was like a kid in a candy store. But I realized I would probably never get to learn them all. It was just not practicable or logistically possible, whether I liked the song or not. And it was frustrating and discouraging. So with the first weeding out last year I got the list down to 70ish. Still this was a discouraging number. It was overwhelming. Mostly because there were still songs that just because I like them doesn't mean I need to learn to play them, or want to.
So this is where the fear and impatience comes in. Fear of having had such a monumental task ahead of me, and the impatience of wanting it completed, knowing it never would or could or would be. So I weeded out another 10 songs. All those weeded out go into another binder just not to trash them. That would be foolish. As I was going through what was was left (all 60 of them) I looked at a few and thought well these really aren't too hard, what am I waiting for?
I feared taking on The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald. I mean, it's a pretty long song, and sounds complicated. So I gave it a shot. It's 6/8 time with a very simple progression of Asus2 Em G D Asus2 4x in each verse. There is a solo that can be played over the chords if you have a lead guitarist, but it's not necessary.
I looked at It Don't come Easy also. And played it. What a piece of cake. And all this time I was afraid of these songs. No wonder I haven't progressed, or so I think. The saying goes "nothing ventured, nothing gained". Fear is a progress killer.
It is difficult to answer when one does not understand the question.
Frank,
Well I guess when I first started I was in a similar situation I'd say almost exactly the same. I printed off every song that caught my fancy and pretty soon I had piles of tab for songs I'd never get too.
Then I started with my current instructor and pretty much only focus on a song a week (I do have more than one song a week going on but one main new one) and I just threw out all of the internet tab. 99% is crap anyway so I wasn't missing much.
Now when I go in and want to work on a song it's whatever the band wants to play, I haven't gotten any songs I couldn't play anymore although some take more time than others to learn so I guess I don't have any fear anymore but then again most of the songs we are playing aren't that difficult.
Now if you are talking about really fast/long solo's I'm just now starting to break the ice with those. I can do several solo's but still can't just sit down and learn the sols's from every song we play.
So the only tab I have kept is tab from my teacher more as reference than anything else. Once I learn a song I don't have any need to go back to the tab. (Maybe in I'm having a short Alzheimer moment if we play a song we haven't played in awhile)
So I guess I just added another rambling post with no purpose.
"It's all about stickin it to the man!"
It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!
No, not rambling at all. I got a really important boost when you mentioned a song a week. If I keep up with my current feeling of confidence and stick to a plan and goal, and not go off into the wild blue yonder, especially with the songs that have easier progressions and rhythms... Blue on Black, Can't You See, Lady Madonna, Let It Be, Hey Jude, Stand by Me... those are my genre... I could probably get one out per week or two. Some that are a little more complicated might take longer.
It is difficult to answer when one does not understand the question.
Man, you covered about two dozen topics all at once.
OK, I'm with you on the number of songs played. I play a ton. Almost all rhythm and strumming. With my memory what it is, I do this with song sheets. Chord sheets, if you will. I will take a sheet gotten off the internet and compare it to the song book(s) that I've purchased and listen to the song a few times and finalize the final song chord sheet. Always educational and does help one to remember inros, outros, bridges, proper timing and sometimes even cues.
I'm about to make you look like you are too centrally focused. I have 256 songs in a speadsheet that I call "Songs For Sharing", which simply means that they are songs I can do on about 5 minute's notice and with a chord sheet. Most of them I can do without the notice. These are all one guitar arrangements. Not note for note covers as if I was playing with a band. Call it a one guitar tribute to Ronnie Spector. :lol: :lol:
I also have a list that I maintain called "New Tries" in process of learning, one list called "Too Difficult" and one called "Purgatory". The "Purgatory" needs updated. This is where songs go when I get sick of them or are just too tough on my hand for bar chording. These lists add another 137 songs to the mix.
And I am quite sure I have fallen behind on my spreadsheet miserably in the past couple of months. I'll have to add songs as I think of them. Probably no more than a 1/2 dozen or so.
If I was with a band and doing covers, the list would be much, much smaller and I will have had to learn the songs note for note, leads included. But I'm not, so I don't. :mrgreen:
One thing I did do was to make several smaller lists. Lists of 21 songs each. I gave the lists some ridiculously name called Set 1, Set 2, Set 3, etc. No idea why I chose 21 songs. Must have read something recently that made sense. Otherwise, it is completely random. What is does for me is it bunches the songs together nicely in smaller groups. Makes the task of learning them all seem less insurmmountable. It's worked great so far.
The big thing, is you gotta do what you gotta do. You can make smaller folders, make 1 giant one and go alphabetically, use then as wall paper, whatever. No rules. I could not look at that many songs in one list, so I kept that list, but made those sets I was talking about. Made learning all them songs look easier. My sister in law can't look at things in a straight line and organize them. She organizes using a "C" shaped fashion, and no place has any more meaning than another. We're all different.
Roy
"I wonder if a composer ever intentionally composed a piece that was physically impossible to play and stuck it away to be found years later after his death, knowing it would forever drive perfectionist musicians crazy." - George Carlin
I do keep a list of the songs I've learned and it's pretty much up to date but I really haven't figured out why I even keep it?
I'm not sure what purpose it really serves, I guess the real only purpose is that when I look at it I know if I have a "tab" for it and by tab my definition is a tab I worked out with my instructor, but even that serves almost no purpose in reality.
I don't have any chord sheets or anything like that so if I don't remember the song I don't play it or I don't play it until I've had a quick run through to make sure I remember it.
But actually now that I think about it when we get together to practice with the band we work on specific songs we rarely just start jamming on an unknown song so there is a focus required. Frank and Roy I think you find that your lists will shrink if you were playing with other people on a regular basis you wouldn't have time to work on a million different things you have to focus on what the band was doing more. I still do my other stuff (songs that I like) but I don't invest alot of time in that.
Playing in a band situaton with another guitar I guess is different for one I don't want to be playing the same thing the other guitar is playing and two none of the songs are "strummy" songs although I guess Blue on Black is one that's pretty much a strummy song for what I do. I haven't done any of the leads in that song I leave that to the other guitarist since this was one of "his" songs.
"It's all about stickin it to the man!"
It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!
Man, you covered about two dozen topics all at once.
If I could communicate telepathically I would overload the recipient. :shock:
I will take a sheet gotten off the internet and compare it to the song book(s) that I've purchased and listen to the song a few times and finalize the final song chord sheet.
I call that "triangulation". I got that term from someone else who said he takes the best parts of several sources, makes sure it's all the same key, and re-works it to something do-able.
I'm about to make you look like you are too centrally focused. I have 256 songs in a speadsheet that I call "Songs For Sharing", which simply means that they are songs I can do on about 5 minute's notice and with a chord sheet. Most of them I can do without the notice. These are all one guitar arrangements. Not note for note covers as if I was playing with a band. Call it a one guitar tribute to Ronnie Spector. :lol: :lol:
It wouldn't take me long to get up to 256 sogs either, but remember that I'm at this only a little over two years. It was two years in January. When I did Runaway Train, it was along with two or three other songs in the same night, which I cranked them all out in a couple of hours. Granted they were easy chord changes and strumming patterns. The same thing happened last night. I think that's what I should have been doing all along. I wanted to go for the harder stuff early on.
I also have a list that I maintain called "New Tries" in process of learning, one list called "Too Difficult" and one called "Purgatory". The "Purgatory" needs updated. This is where songs go when I get sick of them or are just too tough on my hand for bar chording. These lists add another 137 songs to the mix.
I have a kind of nebulous sorting system too, that I think is going to gel a lot more into Can Play; Needs Practice; Try Next; and You Gotta Be Freakin' Kidding Me!
The big thing, is you gotta do what you gotta do. You can make smaller folders, make 1 giant one and go alphabetically, use then as wall paper, whatever. No rules. I could not look at that many songs in one list, so I kept that list, but made those sets I was talking about.
Yep, that's why I pared this down to what I really want to do. It's like cleaning out your closet and clothes drawers: you don't pull out what you don't want; you keep what you do want and get rid of the rest.
It is difficult to answer when one does not understand the question.
Frank don't get into the same crutch I'm in and that is if you just keep learning more strummy songs your not growing as a guitarist. I think Jamie Andreas calls that hoizontal growth, sure you learn more songs but playing 20 different songs with just different chords won't help you play anything more difficult than that.
(Of course if that's your goal then I guess it would be good enough but if you ever end up in a band and unless it was all acoustic there ain't going to be much of the strummy stuff you'll be playing so you'll end up relearning the actual guitar part you are trying to duplicate)
What we all need to do is try and work on vertical growth where we are learning new techniques etc and pushing yourself.
I know it's to easy to fall into the trap cuz I'm there too that's whay I am really trying tomake an effort to better my soloing skills and speed. I don't want to be a shredder but in almost every decent solo there are a least a few fast runs and those still give me problems.
"It's all about stickin it to the man!"
It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!
I'm sure down the line I'll want to work on different techniques. Just not now. If I decide to get into lead and solo, I think it will be after becoming proficient on bass and the use of pentatonics. Kill two birds with one stone.* Right now my bass is limited to use of R 3 5 or R b3 5 over the chords being played. And that's perfectly acceptable. Some successful bass players never leave that comfort zone. I'll eventually pick up chord/melody again. I worked on that 20 years ago. It has lots of uses.
*No animals were harmed in the making of this thread.
It is difficult to answer when one does not understand the question.
I've always got something in the works. Actually, normally it's many things in the works. Sometimes I practice my scales, which recently got revitalized into my "routine", sometimes I play some songs and sometimes I work at the project songs. Those are things like playing and recording all the guitar pieces for a song against a backing track created from a decent Guitar Pro file. These always have some hills to climb and things to learn.
In the end, everyone's gotta do their own thing. I was in the strumming rut for a few years, and staying there was my choice. It was also my choice to start looking at other techniques and such and learn different things. I didn't have a deadline. It was all when I was ready or eager to do so.
Roy
"I wonder if a composer ever intentionally composed a piece that was physically impossible to play and stuck it away to be found years later after his death, knowing it would forever drive perfectionist musicians crazy." - George Carlin
Roy I hear you and I think we are all the pretty much in the same boat, we like to do what we like to do and there is no rush on my part either and I hope I didn't come across as a know it all trying to tell you guys what you need to do that wasn't my point so sorry if it might have come across like that.
Maybe it's just me writing what I feel about my own playing sometime. It's not like I'm going to lose sleep over it but it does seem discouraging at times that I'm not better than I am and I think some of it has to do with not being as focused as I should be and not stretching the limits on my playing. Kinda of a catch 22, I'm not good at something or it's difficult I might tend to shy away from it rather than jumping in and really working on it.
But we all know it's all about what floats your boat and sometimes I'd rather be there by myself running through scales than jamming with the band, other days I just want to crank it up and break windows.
Frank I think the bass will be a good addition and I bet it will help with the guitar soloing down the road.
Both you and Roy are into a lot more "stuff" than I can handle, roy with the singing and recording and you with the bass etc. To me I feel like I'm falling behind if I'm not playing the guitar that's why I've never got into the recording thing, I don't want to waste any of the few hours I have to practice meesing with software etc. I think all my time needs to be spend with the instrument.
Thanks Frank now you got me depressed again about my lack of skills.. :(
"It's all about stickin it to the man!"
It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!
Nah, don't be depressed. If it's any consolation I can only play a few bass lines. But let me tell you, it's a juggling act. It's not easy switching back and forth, rather, deciding which to work with. I had not touched the bass in at least a month while I fought with a few guitar songs. How You Remind Me and Ain't No Sunshine drove me nuts. I finally put them down for a while to clear my head. I'm almost ready to pick them up again, but with a different approach. I picked up the bass and worked with it for a week going nuts working out the bass line for My Sweet Lord, which as I mentioned, I pretty much had to do from scratch and followed the rhythm guitar chords. Besides, you've done things I would love to experience, like the band and having a teacher you have a great rapport with. Now I have to ask my shrink to increase my Lexapro. Thanks a lot! :lol:
It is difficult to answer when one does not understand the question.
I say we all chuck it all out the window, find ourselves some hammocks along some uncrowded, tropical beach under a few palm trees and wail on ukuleles and drink cocktails all day.
Oh crap. That remindss me. I have not practiced the Uke in a few days. :(
Roy
"I wonder if a composer ever intentionally composed a piece that was physically impossible to play and stuck it away to be found years later after his death, knowing it would forever drive perfectionist musicians crazy." - George Carlin
Roy I'll go for that...heck we don't need a tropical beach all we need to do is take a couple hour road trip from your place to the Outer banks they are good enough for me.
"It's all about stickin it to the man!"
It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!
I'm all for taking up the recorder barring all else coming to fruition. :lol:
It is difficult to answer when one does not understand the question.
Oh, and cnev, I think you're miles ahead of me. I don't know any songs note for note enough to play with others. You win. (roy searches for bowing down to greatness emoticon) Oh, and you've done open nights. and regularly play with others for two years at least. You win again. :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
Roy
"I wonder if a composer ever intentionally composed a piece that was physically impossible to play and stuck it away to be found years later after his death, knowing it would forever drive perfectionist musicians crazy." - George Carlin
