Progressive Metal Help....

Metal music arose from a fusion of jazz and rock with influences from classical theory, producing a music which gradually evolved into several complex styles which emphasizing an existential but nihilistic view of reality, civilization, and the limits of human consciousness. As a collective system of thought believes in the individual, the inherent worthlessness of material things, the value and inspiration of fantasy and imagination, the intensity of creation, the power of destruction. The music is closely joined to intensely alienated social values but translates this dissent into a non-political yet unwaveringly steadfast metaphorical resistance to mainstream thought process.

Heavy Metal

My random thoughts on metal. may not be the answer you were looking for.

Joe

Sidenote: If you are already decided upon using the very same progressions, scales and whatnot, then what exactly is the progressive part? The whole idea behind progressive is that there is progression, or in other words, you think of your own things to add to whatever genre you want to be progressive in.

Wow, pretty harsh responses here...

Sure, a huge part of the progressive rock/metal thing is the originality, but there are definitely some recurring themes in what has become a fairly established genre.

Start off by saying that generally, progressive players tend to be more technically adept at their craft, there is an emphasis on speed and precision, and so those are going to be things that you need to work on technique-wise. The Petrucci DVD probably has you pretty well covered there.

Theory wise, diversity truly is your friend. Watching Petrucci explain the theory behind some of his licks is probably enough to show you that his knowledge of scales/modes/chord construction is fairly vast, and that's important when you're trying to write music that gets away from the "radio sound" and you still want it to sound coherent.

The last thing I'll mention is a diversity of time signatures. A lot of prog rockers mix it up quite a bit in this area, and it certainly adds an element of interest to a lot of songs. To practice this, you are almost going to NEED a full featured drum machine, or a versatile computer based loop creator. Playing consecutive measures of 4/4, 3/4, 5/4 is not something that comes naturally, but it's the kind of skill very much worth having in this genre.

All that aside, you're biggest challenge in progressive rock/metal is probably going to be getting a decent band together that's interested in diving into this genre.

Thank you so much guys for your response.

I don't think Arjen intended to be harsh, just broke it down the way it was, so thanks.

However, I can't thank you enough undercat. What you said makes a lot of sense. I always look to improve my theory, and also progress continously learning new scales. I would however, like to learn how exactly to "learn" or "practice" a scale.

I also apprecaite the way you have pointed out time signatures. I'm getting pretty comfortable with 4/4 timing. Now to get the other one down. Can you point me to a good lesson for timing, with audio examples of beats and measures?

Once again, thank you so much for all your help!

Can you point me to a good lesson for timing, with audio examples of beats and measures?

You can thank Mr. Hodge for this Free Lesson. Which was written for this site!

Hmmm... learning mutliple time signatures... In my own case, I kind of cheated by drumming for about 2 years before I started with guitar, I developed a very strong command of unusual rhythmic figures.

But since that doesn't reallly help you... here's a pile of tips! :lol:

To start off getting the hang of unusual time signatures, I'd say just get a metronome and set it to accent every 3rd/5th/6th/7th beat, while you try and play some simple I-IV-V rhythm guitar over it, putting your changes on the "1's". If you've been playing 4/4 and nothing else for a long time, just hop in slowly, because it's going to feel odd.

Try to not superimpose 4/4 figures on top of the new time signature, and recognize that each one has it's own particular groove. This takes a little bit of time, be patient, the rewards are tight.

Thanks for the reply guys. Do you know of a lesson with audio samples of the times? It would be quite helpful. I have always had trouble reading about time. Thanks for all your help so far!

There is a book that I bought on clearance for a couple bucks. I thought it was probably out of print or soon to be out of print but I checked and it's still available. It's called Understanding Rhythm For Guitar by David Mead. It has a CD for reference and to practice with and is strictly about timing. It could really be for any instrument as there is not much of anything covered that applies only to guitar, but this guy is a guitarist and has other guitar books out there so I guess that's why it says "for guitar" in the title. Anyway, check it out if you can. It actually sells for about the usual $20 unless you can find a used copy.

whoot my favorite genre!

I totally agree with the third post: The beauty of prog is that there are no constraints or rules. That being said, odd time signatures and complicated, deep, and unnatural melodies and harmonies are something you'll have to get used to in prog. I'd say prog players also are influenced tremendously by other types of music. Symphony X for example, has a ton of jazz and classical influence, which you don't see in many bands today. So get your chops in order before you try to tackle something like pull me under, cause i gurantee most prog songs will be in the intermediate-highly advanced catagoree for guitarists.

Progressive rock goes back a long ways. Listen to some Yes, Genesis, Emerson Lake and Palmer (listen to Al di Meolas Elegant Gypsy and Casino albums for some more Jazz oriented but still progressive style). The one big thing I noticed about Progressive Rock and Metal is that it takes time to get used to. A lot of people, especially these days, don't have the attention span to listen to it. It requires thought and open-mindedness.

I think the main ideal behind Progressive Rock and Metal is that it tells a story. That is, there is a main theme, a build up, a plot change and a resolution or climax. In the end it may not sound like the same song. A person might think that the accent is on the technicality but in reality I think the technicality is in many ways a means to an ends. That in actuality it would be difficult to write this style without some technical proficiency.

If you listen to a good portion of what might be considered Prog Rock or Metal you start to realize that the focus is really on melody and harmony and that the noodling has it's place in the song but is not necessarily the main focus. Many times the theme is as melodic as any you would find in what would be considered classic rock.

Bottom line, I think is; like in any music, you need to be able to express the Ideas in your head. In which case and to finally answer the question, all and any theory you can get your hands on is necessary for you to write Progressive music of any kind. You need to know or have a grasp of theory well enough that you can play without thinking about the theory. Theory is the basis for expression but the expression must come from your heart.

First off, thanks a lot for replying guys. Turned out to be a good topic, didn't it? I certainly learned some good insights on this topic. What you guys said makes a lot of sense, and has certainly given me a better idea, about how to go about this. All I know is that, I won't be making progressive music, anytime soon, I have A LOT to learn and to be able to do. Once again, thank you all for your inputs!