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John Dowland & A Celtic Piece

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(@joehempel)
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I went to the Ohio Renaissance Festival yesterday, and thought I'd try my hand at a couple pieces. Both are short coming in at about 1:00 each. John Dowland piece is recorded with my Classical guitar, the Celtic piece is recording with my Acoustic.

1. I recently discovered John Dowland when searching for Renaissance music and fell in love with the music. Even ordered a book online of his works (hopefully will have it today)
This piece is one of his easier ones, though still kind of hard for me. It's called Mrs. Winters Jump.

http://www.box.net/shared/85278i1k8d

2. I purchased a Guitar Atlas Celtic book a couple weeks ago and this is a Lament from that book, it's called My Fair Young Love (A Lady to her Husband who was Killed at the Battle of Culloden)

http://www.box.net/shared/ssli4uopv8

Let me know what you think.

In Space, no one can hear me sing!

 
Posted : 05/10/2009 1:34 pm
(@alangreen)
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Can't beat a good bit of John Dowland. I'll have a listen later.

Check out Robert Johnson (William Shakespeare's mate, not that Robert Johnson), Francis Cutting, Luis Milan and Daniel Batchelor (sp?) for good Renaissance stuff, and anything labelled "Anonymous 15th Century" will also be worth having a go (don't forget the English Renaissance was 100 years after the European so you'll find some gems in the 16th century repertoire too). And "Greensleeves" was a dance, not a song title, so there's a bunch of them to work at too.

A :-)

"Be good at what you can do" - Fingerbanger"
I have always felt that it is better to do what is beautiful than what is 'right'" - Eliot Fisk
Wedding music and guitar lessons in Essex. Listen at: http://www.rollmopmusic.co.uk

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 8:42 am
(@joehempel)
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Thanks for that Alan, I will look them up! I've been asking around the delcamp forums, but no one says anything to me LOL.

In Space, no one can hear me sing!

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 8:45 am
(@alangreen)
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They can be a bit snooty over there at times - there was a thread there once titled "Do you secretly play electric"

Electric?

Secretly?

Ask my neighbours, it's no secret.

A :-)

"Be good at what you can do" - Fingerbanger"
I have always felt that it is better to do what is beautiful than what is 'right'" - Eliot Fisk
Wedding music and guitar lessons in Essex. Listen at: http://www.rollmopmusic.co.uk

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 8:48 am
(@joehempel)
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They can be a bit snooty over there at times

So far I've ran into nothing but snooty. They took down my post of Mrs. Winters Jump because they didn't consider my nylon string guitar a classical guitar. I think I'm just going to download all I can from there, and then cancel my account.

In Space, no one can hear me sing!

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 9:19 am
(@alangreen)
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That's the guitar with the cutaway that I saw on your Youtube post, right?

I must admit I looked at it and thought it looked different to usual, but it sounded good to me and surely that's what counts.

A :-)

"Be good at what you can do" - Fingerbanger"
I have always felt that it is better to do what is beautiful than what is 'right'" - Eliot Fisk
Wedding music and guitar lessons in Essex. Listen at: http://www.rollmopmusic.co.uk

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 12:02 pm
 KR2
(@kr2)
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They can be a bit snooty over there at times

So far I've ran into nothing but snooty. They took down my post of Mrs. Winters Jump because they didn't consider my nylon string guitar a classical guitar. I think I'm just going to download all I can from there, and then cancel my account.
Whoa!
Upload a video of you playing a banjo . . . and they'll probably cancel your account for you.

It's the rock that gives the stream its music . . . and the stream that gives the rock its roll.

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 1:05 pm
(@alangreen)
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LOL

I'll have you know I have a mp3 of John Williams, the rather famous classical guitarist, playing a duet with the other person playing a banjo.

"Be good at what you can do" - Fingerbanger"
I have always felt that it is better to do what is beautiful than what is 'right'" - Eliot Fisk
Wedding music and guitar lessons in Essex. Listen at: http://www.rollmopmusic.co.uk

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 2:04 pm
(@joehempel)
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LOL, wow!!

They put the link back up, and they are re-writing their rules, or at least take a hard look at them. This is the last PM that was sent to me by one of the moderators:
Hi Joe,

You've raised an interesting point. We haven't had this kind guitar recording previously. It's either been acoustic or electric and the latter have been removed. We will ask JF Delcamp how this fits in with the rules.

Regards,

Paul

EDIT: As it turns out they took both video and mp3 that I posted down. Here's the entire conversation (goes from the bottom up):

Re: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

Sent: Tue Oct 06, 2009 10:13 am
by Paul
Hi Joe,

I'm really sorry Joe, :desole: but JF Delcamp is against the acoustic electric guitar. Basically a recording needs to be of the natural sound of the guitar with an open air microphone, not via electronic pickups, so your two contributions fall out of bounds. Sadly, they will now both have to be moved out of the forum. :(

I really hope you will be able to re-record them with a classical guitar sometime soon.

My sincere apologies.

Kind regards,

Paul
Re: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

Sent: Tue Oct 06, 2009 7:37 am
by joehempel

I'll be honest and say that I find that hard to believe. I just don't think it was brought up.

If it helps my video has been up for a while.

viewtopic.php?f=72&t=44158

That's the same guitar I used and in the same way.

Thanks
Joe

Re: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

Sent: Tue Oct 06, 2009 6:56 am
by Paul
Hi Joe,

You've raised an interesting point. We haven't had this kind guitar recording previously. It's either been acoustic or electric and the latter have been removed. We will ask JF Delcamp how this fits in with the rules.

Regards,

Paul

Re: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

Sent: Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:33 am
by joehempel
It's a thin body Classical and I don't have a good mic to pick it up. So the only way to record it is to use the electric parts to plug it in.

Thanks for re-posting!
Joe Hempel

Re: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

Sent: Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:29 am
by Paul
Hi Joe,

Whoops. That was fairly embarrassing. :oops: :oops: I guess the electric bit and the plugging directly into the computer confused me.

I guess as long as it's picking up the acoustic sound of the guitar it's fine. :oops:

Give me a minute and it'll be back.

Regards,

Paul

Re: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

Sent: Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:13 am
by joehempel
Yes I did, it's an Ibanez Classical guitar.

http://ibanez.com/AcousticGuitars/model-EWN28KOENT

This is my exact guitar.

Re: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

Sent: Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:08 am
by Paul
Hi Joe,

I feel really terrible doing this, but I've had to take your recording out of the forum because you didn't play it on a classical guitar. :desole:

The rules over here viewtopic.php?t=1550#p11236 state the following:

Only acoustic recordings of acoustic instruments are accepted
Please only post recordings of classical guitar, lute, theorbo, baroque guitar and renaissance guitar, and preferably as natural as possible, in one take with no digital editing. Recordings of electric guitar, folk guitar, steel-string guitar, midi or synthesiser guitar or Silent Guitar will be deleted without notice.

Would you be able to re-record it on a classical?

Regards,

Paul

Subject: Dowland, John; Mrs. Winters Jump (Beginners)

joehempel wrote:I've only just discovered John Dowlands works, as I'm not all that into Classical Music, but love classical fingerstyle.

However, John Dowland is phenomenal in my opinion, the type of music he creates I absolutely love. After hearing Mr. Delcamps version I downloaded the PDF, transcribed it to tab (can't sight read yet) and learned it.

So while I've been playing guitar for about two years I'm a beginner in this type of music, so here is as close as I could come.

Let me know what you think?

Oh, it's recorded with an Ibanez EWKOE28NT Classical/Electric with it's output right into the computer.

My response is sure to get me kicked off the forum, because I feel insulted:

Well, considering this IS a classical guitar, I'm NOT going to re-record it. I'm not going to just go and get another guitar to record with this form because it's not a classical. I've got plenty of other places to share work and ask for advice, and if this site is going to be as pretentious as to say that my guitar doesn't qualify or isn't "good" enough, then I don't need to be here. Maybe there should be a list of models that "qualify" Classical guitars. I'll make sure to let Ibanez know that their EW line of nylon string guitars are not classical and they should not market them as such.

Good day

In Space, no one can hear me sing!

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 2:12 pm
(@lue42)
Posts: 356
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Either you did delete your account, or they canceled it! Wow... what a bunch of snobs.

What is the freakin' difference between whether the mic is mounted inside the guitar and plugged into the computer or on a mic stand and plugged into the computer.

Isn't it about the music? The art of playing? Not about the reproduction of the sound?

Honestly, people like that give musicians a bad name - how dare they say that what I am playing is not worth of their site? Up until recently, I didn't even own a classical... and the one I own now is not a very expensive one (although, I think it sounds fantastic).

Ugh.

My Fingerstyle Guitar Blog:
http://fsguitar.wordpress.com

My Guitars
Ibanez Artwood AWS1000ECE-NT
Schecter S-1 30th Anniversary Edition
Ovation CS257
LaPatrie Etude
Washburn Rover RO10

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 5:53 pm
(@alangreen)
Posts: 5342
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I had a listen and it all sounds fine. It does sound like a steel string guitar though

Mistress Winter's Jump - attack the melody on this one, it needs to bounce along. A nice job done though.

My Fair Young Love - I didn't know this one but it sounds really good. Aim for a nice flowing melody line and you'll have that one nailed.

A :-)

"Be good at what you can do" - Fingerbanger"
I have always felt that it is better to do what is beautiful than what is 'right'" - Eliot Fisk
Wedding music and guitar lessons in Essex. Listen at: http://www.rollmopmusic.co.uk

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 6:42 pm
(@joehempel)
Posts: 2415
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The Celtic One, that's done on my steel string, Mrs. Winters Jump is on a Classical.

Thank you for the feedback, I'll work on the melody a bit, the fingerings are a bit odd for me, but the bouncy feeling is what I love about the song, so I'll get a new version of that along soon.

My Fair Young Love needs some work. It's a lament so slow and flowing it should be. That's coming again too.

Thanks again Alan, appreciate the listen and the feedback!

In Space, no one can hear me sing!

 
Posted : 06/10/2009 7:50 pm
 Taso
(@taso)
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Joe,

Sounds really nice. I'm absolutely unfamiliar with either tune, so that's all I can really say :P Like the first one a lot.

By the way, what's that forum so I can be sure to never post there?

http://taso.dmusic.com/music/

 
Posted : 07/10/2009 4:05 am
 KR2
(@kr2)
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I think they need to decide if their forum is about the guitar . . . or the skill in playing it.
Guitar stores are for guitars . . . I would think the forum would be about being able to play it.
But it's their forum . . . I think they're being a little too purist in their approach.
Them thar uppity, high falutin' classical geetar fellers . . .
"We don't allow no stinkin' mutt guitar" should be how they word their new policy.

It's the rock that gives the stream its music . . . and the stream that gives the rock its roll.

 
Posted : 07/10/2009 4:25 am
(@joehempel)
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LOL, thanks guys appreciate the support. I think I may have been a little harsh in my reply, but what's done is done. So I won't list the site or anything, you would have to really search for a Classical Guitar forum to find it, and even then I don't remember how I stumbled upon it.

Like you said Ken, it's their site, I don't have to post there or go there, there are places like this to get advice and share work which have people that give good, constructive, humorous feedback.
Sounds really nice. I'm absolutely unfamiliar with either tune, so that's all I can really say Like the first one a lot.
Thanks Taso!! I just recently discovered John Dowland, and this arrangement is from that forum mentioned above, and that's the recording that sparked all this actually.

The other one is an Anonymous Celtic Tune from the Guitar Atlas Series Celtic book, it's a really good book series and I plan on getting the Japanese one as well.

In Space, no one can hear me sing!

 
Posted : 07/10/2009 4:41 am
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