Playing guitar AND bass....

I sing, play lead guitar, rhythym guitar, bass, and drums.. as well as a little keyboard, trumpet, violin, and many other musical instruments. My life revolves around music, it is my reason for living. Bass is my main instrument, but I actually play my guitar a little bit more than my bass. And I play everything else every once in a while.

I find that it is much more satisfying to learn songs from the radio. Most of the time, I sit and try to find new chord transitions, etc. I actually taught myself to play all those instruments except for trumpet. I believe thatplaying bass FIRST helps with learning and understanding guitar. For some odd reason, I find it extremely easy to sing and play guitar at the same time, but to sing & play bass at the same time, I have to practice both parts individually over and over first.

For me, on any left handed bass or guitar, finger picking is natural (I'm still training my right hand to use a pick accurately), and when I play a left handed guitar(yes, I play both ways, too. left and right) it is easier to use a pick. I NEVER use a pick on a bass, EVER.

I, as a bassist, have also realized that bassists have their instruments higher up on their bodies. It came naturally to me, in fact, I didn't even realize that I was doing it, and I play standing and sitting. I even have my guitar higher than normal. The only reason that I can think of for this is that it is more comfortable and puts less stress on the joints.

Thanks for posting this topic,
Brandon Pace
Power Bass

hi and greeting to yet another left handed player :D

UPDATE.....

I seem to have been playing bass quite a lot lately....callouses are now so thick I could probably sandpaper a door with them...and not just om my fretting hand, also on my picking hand....

What I have been doing, in a few spare moments, is playing along with a lot of songs on the TV....

Anyway, this is what I've discovered so far....

1 - Playing bass has really helped guitar playing....

A - Increased finger strength, able to stretch more easily....
B - Because I've started learning bass from scratch, I have been able to concentrate on my main flaw as a guitarist....that old wandering thumb!
When I'm playing bass, my thumb has never strayed from the back of the neck to the top and even round to the fretboard....

2 - Playing guitar has helped with bass!!!

Because I play mostly rhythm and fingerpicking, I concentrated a lot on chords and chord construction...I tend to use chords when playing bass as well,
and play a lot of arpeggios and licks instead of just root notes, which I was doing at first....

The only drawback I can find is that my wrists tend to ache after playing bass....I'm still experimenting with the most comfortable position to play in, seems I haven't found it yet...and I still haven't tred to play standing up....!

Ah well, the main thing is, I can feel there's been a big improvement....

:D :D :D

Vic

Great update!

The TV thing - I was thinking about doing that myself, but on the digital music channels they have on our cable system; all these different genres, all going constantly; great for the ear, and it makes practicing lots more fun. Plus with the remote you can just bounce back and forth between, say, Acid Funk and Traditional Reggae. Not that I've done that, but...it's possible.

That wandering thumb thing, yah; it's really hard to do on a 5-string, let me tell you! And that's the one I normally start off with. You know, take that out, watch Survivor, or Most Haunted, and just plunk away. Roundwound strings, .045-.100 (I think), and just getting into it. Then switching to the 4-string Squier with .040-.095 flatwounds on a commercial break, and it feels like butter!

You know, congrats on the chordal thing, really. Most guitarists want to flash their latest riff or run or mode or harmonic minor or whole-tone or diminished scale and forget (usually) about chord tones. And forget about anyone wanting 'to be' a rhythm guitarist. I think I only met two players in my life who only wanted to play rhythm - with no aspirations to lead playing. But when it comes right down to it, it still comes back to chords, and chordal tones, and I think it's remarkable that someone would actually delve into that part things more than the flash. Knowing chord tones and different arpeggios - even if it's just one or two variations - REALLY helps the musical side of things; not just the technique or the theory of it. It sort of blends both together and your 'understanding' of music (again, not theoretically, but in a practical sense) really starts to jump. I didn't actually get into picked single note arpeggios until about 3 years ago. Before that it was either strumming (on guitar now), OR playing lead - scales, riffs, rave-ups, etc. But then, long story (well, too late) short(er), I got into drum machines, got into odd rhythms, and started doing arpeggios (but not just fingerpicked or block-chorded individual notes. It instantly had an effect on my playing, even just fooling around with it for half an hour at a time.

I wish I'd done that 20 years earlier :0

That said, all that new information is now 'inside' and it translates to bass even more. Walking lines, melodic ideas; they're more apparent on the fretboard and under the fingers now. Not that I practice a lot, or even regularly. Now I've got a lap steel (in C6th tuning to start), and...well, that's going to be an interesting combination - especially since I'm using fingerpicks again after...wow, 20 years as well!

Maybe I've finally found the solution to the fingernail issue I've had all these years - nails just right for fingerpicking guitar, but too long for playing finger style bass. Yah, that works. Keep the nails short and use fingerpicks (ecept for the nylon string guitar).

Okay, sorry, just thinking aloud here and realizing some stuff.

Oh, by the way, watch out for that sore wrists thing; you wouldn't want to develop some carpal tunnel stuff or tendonitis. Hey, maybe you could post a picture of your normal way of sitting and playing the bass. If there's anything obviously in need of change, I'm sure someone here will have some suggestions. I tend to get a little ache in my right wrist (fingering hand, since I'm lefty), but when I feel it start, I recognize it and try to move things around a little. I get it more on the long scale basses though - it's never a problem with the Turser Beatle.

And yah, come to think of it, I get a little 'pull' now and then on the picking-hand wrist, from it being at that angle. When I feel anything start to ache that I know is not a muscle, I stop and turn the volume up on the TV and take a break. If it's still there when I start up again then I stop for the night.

Anyhow, sorry for the long winded response, but from what you say it sounds like there really 'has' been a big improvement!

Good going!

OK, this pic was taken a few weeks ago....the daughter took this when I wasn't expecting it, so I must have naturally wound up in that position...

Notice the thumb is peeking over the top, I did spot that....and took pains to correct it.....

The other thing I've noticed, which I forgot to mention, is I'm using my pinky a lot more - it's a bit restricted movement-wise, being a bit mis-shapen, but seems to be a lot stronger these days...

And thanks a lot for the encouragement, Demo....I'll get there eventualy!!! There's no such word as "can't" in my dictionary - literally, as pages 116 to 125 are missing.....

:D :D :D

Vic

Hopefully we'll all 'get there' someday :)

And if we don't encourage each other, well, sometimes it just doesn't happen otherwise.

Anyhow, interesting how even you noticed stuff in the picture. That's why some people suggest playing in front of a mirror from time to time to see how everything is developing.

You obviously don't have a problem being short limbed, so the standard 'Fender scale length' isn't a problem. It looks like you're finger picking - thumb and three fingers - but that's not a problem really either. Actually the only suggestion I could make would be to keep your knuckles parallel to the edge of the neck. See how your knucks are sorta angled off? That makes your pinky have to stretch that much further. If you kind of rotate your left hand a little you'll wind up with more reach than you actually need.

That's pretty good position though. Right shoulder's a little high and tense, but you didn't mention shoulder or neck aches, so that should be okay. I think that's mostly because the picture caught you hunching over the bass a little.

So I guess the wrist aches are from just playing too much, but from the way you look, it's probably too fun to play any less!

Good job. :)

Hmm yes, see what you mean about the left hand - the angle it's at to the fretboard...but I think that pretty much corrected itself once I got my thumb sorted out...getting that in the correct position sort of naturally makes that hand pretty much at right angles to the fretboard...

That chair's not the greatest for playing guitar on, I have to hunch forward...and being fairly low down with my lap higher than normal, the shoulder will naturally be high because of my long arms...I'll try playing on a higher chair, sit a little straighter, see how that goes....

Thanks again for the advice.....

:D :D :D

Vic

It seems to me that you're tilting the bass to see the fretboard, which I've found to be a big mistake from an ergonomic point of view. I didn't expect it to, but it dramatically reduced my reach. I'm not sure how much of your position has to do with the chair, but I've found that whenever I can see the surface of the fretboard I'm in a bad spot.

Hmm yes, see what you mean about the left hand - the angle it's at to the fretboard...but I think that pretty much corrected itself once I got my thumb sorted out...getting that in the correct position sort of naturally makes that hand pretty much at right angles to the fretboard...

That chair's not the greatest for playing guitar on, I have to hunch forward...and being fairly low down with my lap higher than normal, the shoulder will naturally be high because of my long arms...I'll try playing on a higher chair, sit a little straighter, see how that goes....

Thanks again for the advice.....

:D :D :D

Vic

Yah, when that thumb slips into the right place everything else sorta glides around to match. I figured, since you said you corrected the thumb position, the rest of the hand would follow. Old picture, as you said. Your wrists look nice and straight though; I think the aches might just be from overdoing it a bit, which when you're into it, is hard not to do. I just went another hour on the lap steel this evening, and it didn't even seem like an hour!

Oh, something I just noticed (or can't really see actually): your right arm - you've got pretty long arms as you said, but if you were to take your left hand off the neck, would the bass sorta wobble to and fro, like front to back? It seems like the underside of the forearm, almost at the wrist, is making contact with the face of the bass (to hold it against you maybe?) - sort of like it's pressing flat against the body. I was trying to imagine doing that and it seemed a bit different for me. My picking arm does hold the bass securely against me, but it's more the inside of the elbow that makes contact. Sorta like I'm bumping my ribs with my own elbow sort of thing; squeezing the bass between elbow and ribs. Then the forearm is, well, free to move about. I tend to put my thumb on the edge of the neck at the high frets (ala McCartney). It does change though when I pluck near the bridge, but if I let go the neck, the bass still keeps its position. Kind of hard to describe, but...if your picking hand's wrist is getting sore, it 'might' be from your using it to hold the bass to your body and at the same time pluck. In other words my plucking wrist hardly ever touches the body of the bass.

Oh heck, did that make any sense? :|

The left wrist looks great though! Maybe just a tilt forward of the body to make it perpendiular to the floor as Paul said, and that would be it.

See now, you've made me want to take the bass out and play 'it' for awhile! :)

Best