how you should I play a scale?

You're fretting hand sounds fine. One finger per fret.

If you're picking the notes with fingers instead of a pick then I recommend the classical approach which is to forget the thumb and use strictly alternating fingers all the way. The simplest pattern is by alternating just index and middle, and never use the same finger twice in succession.

This is the proper fretting hand fingering for the Major scale (here in G)


Fretting hand fingering
i= index
m= middle
r= ring
p= pinky

e----------------------------------------2--3--
b-----------------------------------3--5-------
g--------------------------2--4--5-------------
d-----------------2--4--5----------------------
a--------2--3--5-------------------------------
e--3--5----------------------------------------
m p i m p i r p i r p m p i m


But don't think you have to play a scale in order. You can do that, but the notes of a scale are simply guides to tell you notes that sound good over a chord or in a certain key. We say the alphabet A thru Z, but that is not how we use the alphabet. We use the letters of the alphabet in many various orders to spell many different words. The notes of a scale are the same.

For instance, here is a very popular Blues riff (but used in Country, Rock, and Jazz too).

popular Blues riff from Major scale (key of G)

You will probably recognize this riff right away. And it follows the same fingering as shown before. But see how you do not have to play a scale up and down in order. You can play it in any order, skip over notes, repeat notes, you can play it anyway you like.

But you do not have to be locked into this fingering also. Experiment with different fingerings. Make playing easy. Some fingers are stronger for bending, or hammer-ons and other techniques. So it is OK to mix the fingering up also.


Lead guitar lick from G Major scale
~~~~~~ ~~~~~~
e-------------3------------------------------------
b-------3h-5--------------------3h—5—-3------------
g---2/4---------------------2/4--------------------
d-5-----------------------5--------------------5--
a--------------------------------------------------
e--------------------------------------------------
& 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 &
r m i r i r m i r i r

h= hammer on
/= slide up
= slide down
~= vibrato


This is just a lick I made up, and the fingering I would use. You might use a different fingering, that's OK. Just wanted you to see that you are not locked into using a set fingering. Learn the proper fingering, but experiment with alternate fingerings all the time. :D

Hope that helped.

cool post Wes Inman iam trying to find this out for a while any more suggestions

Glad that was helpful Frank. I'm sure others like NoteBoat (who teaches) could give better advice than me. I guess my advice would be to concentrate on just a few scales at first. There are literally dozens (maybe hundreds) of different scales. It can be overwhelming. So work on a few scales and play them up and down and inside out until you know them by heart. Work on one position until you are strong in it, then move to the next position. Learn to move from one position to another.

Probably the most popular scales in Western music would be:

1) The Minor Pentatonic- the most used scale in Rock music bar none. Blues too.
2) The Major Pentatonic- the most used scale in Country.
3) Major Scale- used in much popular and religious music.

These are the 3 scales I would learn first.

Glad that was helpful Frank. I'm sure others could give better advice than me.

Your posts have always been top notch Wes. 8)

Your advice has a knack of sounding like it's not from a text book, but always feels like it's come straight off a warm guitar up through your fingers and onto the forum. :)

A year or so back I was trying to find a quote by NoteBoat along the lines of "Practice doesn't make Perfect - it makes Permanent". Those might not have been his words, but he was pointing out the value of making sure you had it right first, or you risk entrenching your mistakes. Anyway, I couldn't find the post. So I thought that maybe in future, whenever I saw a post with some good practical advice that I'd like to re-read, I'd copy it into a Word document. The idea was that one day I might start a "Best Quotes from GN" thread with some of the most useful things I'd seen.

Alas, I never kept the idea up. But a couple of weeks ago I found the file and had a look to see what I had saved. I hadn't saved many, but they were all Wes Inman posts! :D :D I don't think I've heard any of your playing, but you certainly have a gift for passing on very useful practical advice. I don't read all that many threads here but there's some names I'll always check out because they're so good at a particular angle - theory, general tips, learner experiences, humour or whatever. And for straightforward practical advice, nobody's better than W.Inman. 8)

Cheers, and thanks for all the good stuff over the past year or two.

Chris

I'll second that, Chris. Although Wes often downplays his knowledge of theory, he comes across as a mine of incredibly useful and valuable information gained from years of experience. I always look out for his posts.

I'll second that, Chris. Although Wes often downplays his knowledge of theory, he comes across as a mine of incredibly useful and valuable information gained from years of experience. I always look out for his posts.

I wonder if Wes is largely 'self taught'? When I read post by you or NoteBoat I hear the assured voice of people who are not only teachers themselves, but who in all probability had a good solid traditional style musical education of some sort. (Am I allowed to mentioned your very good lessons here?? :wink: Fretsource Lessons )

I designed and built my own house, including some quite detailed cabinetmaking, but I'd had no formal training or apprenticeship in that area, so when I talk about building I tend to sound a lot like Wes' guitar posts, and I downplay what I know. I guess, despite the evidence, you never quite shake off the nagging suspicion that you might have missed something along the way! :)

The fantastic thing about music forums is the chance to share experiences, gain knowldege, and just swap stories with people of all levels and backgrounds. I've learned so much that I wouldn't have got just from a book. If nothing else, I've learned how just about every other player went through the exactly same difficulties that I do, and that I'm not actually any slower, dumber, more rhythmically challenged, or physically limited than the average.. :)

Cheers,

Chris

I haven't read all the other suggestions, because I didn't want to bias my answer. What ever works, works.
Suggestion: I learned a different way of playing studying sitar. Basically, it is a method that relies on holding your index finger down on the string and using your middle finger for the next note, always sliding your index finger and never taking it off the string. It doesn't work for every note patern you will play, but it was a method that was new to me that benefitted my playing alot.

I'll attempt an example, using key of C to make it easy. Let's say you want to play E - G - F - A - G - B - A - C - B - D - E. Use the B string starting at the 5th fret. Put your index finger at the starting position: B string, 5th fret. Use your middle finger to play the G on the 8th fret without taking your index finger off the string, sliding it to the next note at the same time. Play the G, then lift the middle finger and play the F. Use your middle finger to play the A on the 10th fret, while sliding your finger up the neck to the 8th fret. Lift the middle finger and play the G. Continue the pattern. I hope I wrote that in a way you can visualize it, and it might help.

oenyaw,

I'm not sure I would recommend that as the normal wayy to finger scales. It would seem that at some point it would be limiting to your speed to keep sliding into everynote.

There are times where a shift is in order but that's the exception.

I'm going through these with my teacher at the moment. What he does is right out the pattern(I'm currently on the 3rd position of the pent major) and then he will right out a bunch of riffs based on the scale, very similar to what Wes posted above.

Then when I go in we will go over the riffs and then he will play a progression for me to solo over using staying in whichever pattern we are currently working on.

I then try and get some backing tracks of chord progressions and practice them at home.

I wonder if Wes is largely 'self taught'? When I read post by you or NoteBoat I hear the assured voice of people who are not only teachers themselves, but who in all probability had a good solid traditional style musical education of some sort. (Am I allowed to mentioned your very good lessons here?? Fretsource Lessons )

I designed and built my own house, including some quite detailed cabinetmaking, but I'd had no formal training or apprenticeship in that area, so when I talk about building I tend to sound a lot like Wes' guitar posts, and I downplay what I know. I guess, despite the evidence, you never quite shake off the nagging suspicion that you might have missed something along the way!

Thanks for the nice compliments. You know, when I came to GN about 3-4 years ago, I saw there were many beginners here and that it was a truly helpful site. I could really relate to all the struggles beginning guitarists went through as I have never had a single lesson. I pretty much learned by getting some good books at music stores, spending tons of time copying records, and even watching others perform. You have to steal every trick you can.

I don't like giving theory type advice, because I really understand very little about it. There are many great teachers here like NoteBoat. I read his posts all the time and try to understand what he is talking about. And really, this is no different from the way I have been learning over 35 years, I just try to pick up a little here or there all the time.

I had some music classes in Jr. High, I used to could sight read and sing. But I am not really a reader, mostly trust my ear. So, I understand that many beginners do not understand chords, scales, theory.... I know because I was the same way. So I try to write in very simple terms that hopefully anyone can understand. I use really stupid analogies sometimes, the music teachers are probably appalled. :roll:

Anyway, I am no great player. I am just a hack who loves to play and keeps practicing hoping to be a truly good player someday. So nothing has really changed at all since I began. But I hope I can make a few things easier to understand, and I hope I can encourage those who find guitar difficult. I cannot forget the many years of struggle I went through to try to learn and play. But you know, I am glad it is hard. Things that are easy hold no value.

I am glad I am a guitar player, I love it and hope to play till the day I die. :D

Yeah, that was me with the practice quote, Chris - I say it to students all the time.

And yeah, I've had a good solid musical education. I was a drummer early on. I actually studied with Mike Green (percussionist with the Lyric Opera in Chicago) and took master classes with Al Payson (retired percussionist from the CSO). Percussion led me to serious music study in other areas like solfege, theory, history, and composition. I even ended up taking 5 years of classical piano lessons, because it seemed important to understanding how everything works musically.

As a guitarist, I was initially self-taught. At first it was a sideline to the drums and marimbas thing, and I was giving percussion lessons at a local music store for about a year before I ever gave a guitar lesson... but eventually the guitar just took over.

I took my first guitar lesson after I'd been playing for a few years, and discovered I'd been doing a lot of things wrong. It took me at least a couple of years to break the bad habits, so when I say practice makes permanent I'm speaking from experience.

I don't regret the self-teaching period on guitar, because it gives me a perspective I might not have gotten if I'd done it another way - I have a better understanding of the 'why' behind specific techniques, as I was forced to think them through as I re-learned basic skills. In retrospect, I would probably be a better guitarist today if I'd learned the right way from the get-go... but I think I'm a better teacher because I made the mistakes myself.

On the other hand, I wouldn't have been able to approach the guitar the way I do without all the formal education I'd gotten before and during learning the guitar. The general music background from ear training, form and analysis, etc. lets me approach the instrument as a choice, if that makes any sense.

I strive to be a musician who happens to play guitar, rather than just a guitar player. Some day I may even come close to succeeding :)

Hello all

b) remembering wes suggestions about the better way to play shuffle, I'm trying keep all the fingers down until I change string (i mean if i start with medium on E-string i keep it down when I play the A note with pinky and move it only when I have to use it again on the string below)

Matteo

hello all thanks to everyone for your kind answers. I'm so happy seeing that using the correct fingers and I'll take care of all the suggestions. For the moment I concentrate with the G-scale and A-scale (i guess it's the same G scale played at fifth fret instead of 3rd) There is only a question that It does not seem to have been answered (if fingers must stay down until you change string), so I put it again.

Thanks again

Cheers

Matteo

There is only a question that It does not seem to have been answered (if fingers must stay down until you change string), so I put it again.

The answer to your question is Yes and No. :D

Really, that is the answer. It is all about the sound you are after. If you want to play staccato notes (very short and abrupt), then you can instantly let up fretting pressure after playing the note. If you want a very fluid sound you keep the fretted note down. If you play a single scale note on the G string for example and then play another scale note on the B string and want a harmony or chord type tone then you hold the notes down. But if you want to hear only individual notes you would let up on the first note or mute it in some way.

But really when playing a scale as soon as you play a note you let up on the previous note. Your fingers are not locked down to the fingerboard.

Hope that made sense.

thanks Wes, you're as always very enlightning!

cheers

Matteo