Beginner question...
Please describe an unflatted position in a minor scale.
What does that mean????
I can only guess what it means. Take a major scale:
C-D-E-F-G-A-B-C
Now let's make this a natural minor scale:
C-D-Eb-F-G-Ab-Bb-C
You'll notice that the iii, vi and vii have been flatted, to give the natural minor scale. We can check this by taking the relative minor scale to C, which is Aminor.
Major - A-B-C#-D-E-F#-G#-A
minor - A-B-C-D-E-F-G-A
Because it is the relative minor, we should have the same notes in Aminor as in CMajor, which we do.
However, the I, ii, IV, V remain unchanged and unflatted.
Is that what you are looking for?
I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?
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Wild Guess here:
I have never heard this term before either, but could it be referring to the harmonic and melodic minor scales?
The natural minor has a flatted 3, 6 and 7.
The harmonic minor has an "unflatted" 7.
The melodic minor has an "unflatted" 6 and 7.
???
--
Helgi Briem
hbriem AT gmail DOT com
No, because "sharp" indicates a movement upwards, rather than a neutral state (i.e. unchanged).
Still an odd way of describing things IMHO. It's like saying I've got 4 unflat tyres on my car.
I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?
Greybeard's Pages
My Articles & Reviews on GN
Thanks for all the replies!!
I've just started playing the bass. I know my major scale and my natural minor, I'm just not comprehending how to play the harmonic and melodic minors.
The info I have is telling me that in the natural minor the positions are as follows:
1---2---b3---4---5---b6---b7---8
Those b's mean flat, right??
In the harmonic minor it's telling me to "unflat" the b3 and b6 positions... so I would play the whole notes??
Soooooooooo, Grasshopper, you speak of minor scales.
The natural minor has 3 flats - iii, vi, vii
The harmonic minor has 2 flats - iii, vi
and the Melodic minor has only 1 flat - iii
The unflatted note in the harmonic minor is the vii - as it was flatted for the natural minor, you raise it ("unflat it") by a half tone to return it to it's natural state.
I started with nothing - and I've still got most of it left.
Did you know that the word "gullible" is not in any dictionary?
Greybeard's Pages
My Articles & Reviews on GN
OK, I think I'm getting it!!
So the notes in the C natural minor are...
C--D--Eb--F--G--Ab--Bb--C
And the notes in the C harmonic minor are...
C--D--E--F--G--A--B--C???
And the C melodic minor
C--D--E--F--G--Ab--Bb--C???
Opps I messed up, let me try that agian.
Natural C minor:
C--D--Eb--F--G--Ab--Bb--C
Harmonic C minor:
C--D--Eb--F--G--Ab--B--C
Melodic C minor:
C--D--Eb--F--G--A--B--C
;D
Yes.
But why? That's the important part.
Why did people change the b7 to a 7 to make the harmonic minor scale? It has the effect of changing the minor v chord (Gm = G-Bb-D) to a major V or V7 (G = G- B-D-(A)). Why did they want to do that?
Meditate on it.
--
Helgi Briem
hbriem AT gmail DOT com
After a few days of meditation this is what I've come up with........
As I understand it,
The minor is defined by the major...All the same notes, just some" flatted" in the minor.
Common denominator seems to be the b3 position. The flatted 3rd of the major. Then there are more variations ... other flatted positions...6 and 7.
They are all parts of the chromatic scale within that key so they all sound harmonious with one another.
I wasn't really asking "why the minor scale?" That sort of happened pretty much automatically and very early in musical history. Minor scales sound darker and sadder than major scales.
No, the invention of the harmonic major was an entirely intellectual decision, although who made it is unknown (as far as I know).
The two most important chords in major key music (most music) are the I and the V. Some people have said, only half-joking, that all the rest are just passing chords. The I, the tonic is restful and stable. The V is tense and unstable and wants to return back to the I. Adding the dom7 (b7) to the V, making a V7, makes it even more unstable and tense, due to the dissonant b5 interval between the major 3rd and the b7.
Now, in a minor key, the minor v chord, does not have this restless dissonance, thus no urge to return to the i, hence no drama, no sublime fire so beloved to classical composers. Minor key music was rather sedate and boring after they had discovered how powerful the V7-I resolution was. What do do?
Adding a 7th to the v chord was no help, as minor 7th chords sound, if anything, even sweeter and more stable than ordinary minor chords.
The solution was simple. Use a major V or dominant V7 instead. To change the v to a V means raising the 7th degree of the scale and you get that rush of closure. Hence the harmonic minor scale (and later, the melodic minor).
For further info, read David Hodge's articles:
--
Helgi Briem
hbriem AT gmail DOT com
:-[Please forgive me... for I am a mere beginner.
What you say does make sense to me now.
Thanks :)