Hey guys, I just recently got an Epiphone SG Custom. When I went to adjust the truss rod, I loosened it first then gave it a 1/4 turn to tighten it. As it was the first time an allen key was put in the nut, the fit was a little snug. When pulling out the allen key, I gently wiggled it and noticed the entire truss rod sliding out and could hear it moving in the neck. Now I'm unsure exactly what the design of these truss rods are but I assumed the end near the neck joint is usually anchored somehow? I'm concerned that it's broken in some way. The neck does however seem to behave normally when the nut is loosened or tightened.
Is it moving a lot or a little? Up and down along the length of the neck, or rotating?
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It's moving along the length of the neck. It can be pulled out until the nut reaches the angled opening to the cavity.
Adjustable truss rods almost always have an anchor on the end opposite the adjustment nut that's supposed to sit into a pocket routed in the wood. That holds the rod in place, allowing you to control its curve by tightening the nut. I think the Epiphone uses a single rod that fits crosswise into a small threaded cylinder (which is the anchor point that sits in the pocket), but I could be wrong on the design - it may vary with year/location of manufacture.
On that style truss rod, it's possible to back the rod completely out of the cylinder, which would allow the rod to slide up and down.
What's really confusing is that it seems to be working... my best guess is that if you did back it out completely, the cylinder is held securely in the pocket with the threaded hole facing the right way, and you're able to thread it right back into place.
In which case, it's nothing to worry about :)
On the other hand, if it isn't working, that means taking the fretboard off, threading the rod back into the cylinder, and reseating the entire assembly... followed by regluing the fretboard, adjusting the rod, and making sure the frets are still level. With the G-400 Custom having full fretboard binding and inlays, that's not the world's cheapest repair job.
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Thanks for the info and quick replies, much appreciated.
I have another G-400 here and tried to recreate the problem with no luck, truss rod doesn't budge. The strange thing about the Custom is even when tightening the nut and seeing the neck creeping backwards, I can still angle the allen key and wiggle the nut out about 3/4 of an inch to the end of the opening. This makes no sense to me as while it's changing the angle of the neck, it should need to be anchored to do so?
I think this one is going back to the store too, what a bummer. This is the second one with neck issues and it was an xmas present from my wife. First one had a raised 16th fret with dead notes from A to G strings and this one buzzes like crazy at the fifth fret with no tension on the truss rod and with anything resembling normal playable string height. Must be cursed. Years ago I had a Gibson SG Standard, and the neck sucked on that one too. Only one that's had a good neck is the factory 2nd G-400 I have sitting here....go figure.
That makes no sense to me either - if you're able to move the rod back and forth, it has to be free at the other end - and if it is, it can't be compressing the neck, which is what causes the angle to change.
It's possible (barely) you have a different truss rod design. I've seen some rare ones that are double-rod, no end anchor. They work by fitting a rectangular piece tightly into the truss rod slot by the adjusting nut - that's the fixed point for bowing the other end. The design never impressed me; I think the simple physics of it makes it impractical over the long haul (you've got a long way from the end of the truss rod to what's essentially a fulcrum). But anyway, I've never seen one of those in an Epi. If yours ends up having one, I'd find out if A) somebody broke the original and did a repair job with one of these oddballs because it was easier to chisel the adjustment end to make it fit than to do the job right (given where the adjustment is, I kinda doubt this) or B) you've got a knock-off... a Chinese or Indonesian clone in an Epi coat of paint.
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I just realized what I'm turning with the allen key isn't a nut but is actually inside a cylinder that seems to run the length of the neck. The outer cylinder does not rotate, only the inside does. The outer cyclinder and the inner part slide together out of the hole. It's easiest to move the whole thing when there is no tension on whatever I'm turning inside. It's like there is a resistance free spot when rotating the inner part, then as you go counter clockwise it stiffens one way, then clockwise stiffens the other way.
That makes some sense.
Your outer cylinder doesn't run the length of the neck - that's an anchor point for the adustment end. As you turn the inside part, it's forcing that fixed cyllinder closer to/farther away from another fixed anchor at the other end - which compresses the wood, or releases the tension - which is how relief gets adjusted.
Sounds like it might be working right. If you'd broken the rod or lost the threading on the other end, you wouldn't have that increase in tension in both directions.
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I'm gonna try and make peace with this truss rod then :) ,shave a little off that 5th fret and pretend I never looked under the cover to begin with. Thanks again NoteBoat.
