Why Does Epiphone Get No Love?

i had a epi les paul standard plus. i kind of regret selling it.

Both. A good carpenter can build a house with just a hammer and a saw. Give him planes, miter boxes and other stuff and you'll get a better looking house... give the good stuff to a non-carpenter and probably you won't get as good a house as the pro armed with just a hammer and saw.

A good guitarist can make decent music with a poor guitar, and better music with a better guitar. A poor guitarist will see some improvement with a good guitar, but not be able to bring out its full potential.

The guitarist's skill sets the potential - the upper limit of the music. The guitar sets the limit on how much potential can become music.

Noteboat, the master of analogies. What is it with you guitar teachers? Teachers seem to have an anology for every thing. Very good point noteboat.

Recently I played three different Epiphone "MasterBilt" acoustics at Guitar Center and they were all very impressive. At least as good as the Gibson that was sitting nearby, at a fraction of the price (and the Gibson was used, but still more expensive!)
Yeah, I have to agree, the Epi Masterbuilt series are exellent for the money. :)

First, let me say that, if anything I have an affinity for Epi guitars - many centuries ago, when I was still expecting to start shaving one day, I had some guitar lessons with a very good guitar player who happened to own a pre-Gibson Epiphone and a beautiful instrument it was, too.

When I first started looking for a guitar, I was being pulled to Epi, but was put off by a lot of the negative reviews. In the end, I bought a Burns. With no self induced pressure to find a guitar, I've had the chance to look around and play a few for "fun".
The local guitar store had an Ibanez used AS50 for a while - and had I had the wherewithal, I should have bought it. I just felt that they had vastly overpriced it and weren't willing to budge on price. It beat the Epi Dot into a cocked hat as far as playability and build goes. It would have been weel below the price for a new Dot.
I played a Yamaha SA2200, which is about the same price as an Epi Elite 335. I haven't played an Elite 335, but I can say that the Yamaha was probably the best finished semi-acoustic guitar that I've seen, irrelevant of price and brand name.
I bought a used Washburn HB-35 off the Internet. As far as build, playability and sheer sex-appeal goes, the Epi doesn't even make the starting line. I paid less than I would have to pay for a used Epi Dot.

However, I've picked up a couple of Epis that were really good value for money - they were obviously the cream of the crop. The vast majority of Epi gear gets canned because Epi won't pay the extra $2 or so and put decent electronics in the thing - not because of poor finish.

The moral? Look around and TRY as many different guitars as possible, maybe one of them is waiting for YOU and it doesn't need to be a "brand name".

As an aside, I did try out a couple of Fender Squiers and even played a Bullet. The Squier necks played better than any of the US Strats that I've played. The Bullet was also playable (perhaps decent pups would have been in order) and at €65 a bargain. One of the worst guitars that I've had the misfortune to get my hands on was a Fender Strat (the Mex built Lite Ash) - the frets felt like they were made of old wood files.

In the hands of a good guitarist they would ALL have sounded brilliant, so maybe a saw is only a saw, after all

Who's sig was it that said, "To the man with only a hammer, every problem looks like a nail" ?

I have an Epi Wildkat and for what I use it for it's great. I haven't been a fan of the playability of the Masterbilts, then again I've only played a couple.

Nothing at all wrong with them, just not my cuppa tea.

Then again, I don't really like Goodalls either.

The vast majority of Epi gear gets canned because Epi won't pay the extra $2 or so and put decent electronics in the thing - not because of poor finish.
- Greybeard

Greybeard, that brings up a great point. Some people put an incredible amount of value in appearance. Too often, you see someone reviewing a guitar and have admitted to weighing appearance over function. I've never understood that.

Which should be accpeted in this case: "It's not the tool but how you use it." Or: "A craftsman is only as good as the tool he uses".

Both. A good carpenter can build a house with just a hammer and a saw. Give him planes, miter boxes and other stuff and you'll get a better looking house... give the good stuff to a non-carpenter and probably you won't get as good a house as the pro armed with just a hammer and saw.

A good guitarist can make decent music with a poor guitar, and better music with a better guitar. A poor guitarist will see some improvement with a good guitar, but not be able to bring out its full potential.

The guitarist's skill sets the potential - the upper limit of the music. The guitar sets the limit on how much potential can become music.
Exactly the response I was looking for but I must have interjected it at the wrong time since I was only able to elicite one response. Many world renown guitarist can make a book of matches sound like something sent from above.

i have an epi lp, and i love it, it sounds great, and looks great 8)

I read an interview with BB King in the German "Guitar". He said "You can give me any guitar in the world and I'll make it sound like BB King"

Yeah but only a Harley sounds like a Harley or rides like one.

... or these crappy crotch rockets...

Careful buddy....8)

I'll take my crappy crotch rocket and ride circles around you all day... and still not lose a drop of oil. :lol: :lol: :lol:

But yes, we could have this debate over and over again, but not here.

I too own an EPI. a Custom Special AAMOF. I love it. Its beautiful for one, It plays great for two and sounds wonderful for three. I actually think I made a smarter choice with this.

The last time I was in GC I pulled a $2k+ Gibby LP down and well.. I wasn't impressed. I like how my Epi feels much better than the one they had.

Just my .02cents.

Hmm, most of what's needs to be said has been said twice, but it's all very good. Right on guys.

Judging a guitar based on what's on the headstock is just poor judgement. I've played winners and duds from all brands; to generalize is to pass up on a potential treasure, in terms of playability.

At the same time, nothing makes me more suspicious of a guitarists judgement than blanket statements like "Epi's guitars are just as good or better than Gibson's! And only cost 1/4 the price!". That totally misses the point: High cost guitars cost more to build, more expensive labor, more expensive woods, electronics, finishes, more time, etc. That's what you're paying for. Those things cost more, so you pay more for them.

Conversations like this have lead to lots of silly statements like "Gibsons play the same as Epi's so Gibson's should only cost $500." News Flash: Gibsons cost more than that to make!

If there's anything to complain about, it's the price hikes for things that make basically no difference: layers of binding, gold hardware, endorsement, that sort of thing.

I would venture to guess that the Gibson's higher costs are almost all tied up in labor not materials. Yes they use better hardware but it's the labor costs that really hike the price.

Because you paid an American $25/hr instead of a foreigner at $1/hr doesn't necessarily mean that the craftmanship is any better.

I guess my point would be that the extra money you are paying for Gibson's, doesn't necissarily get you anything tangible in terms of tone, playability etc. You just had to pay for the union dues.