week 50 "bloody sheets"

Not only does it probably work for BNA, but it works for me.

This is awesome, I wish I had written most of this, I wouldn't have posted it for fear of it getting stolen.

Good for you and you should let BNA know, and you know I respect your opinion.

However the point of the Sunday Songwriter's isn't a "mutual admiration society". I mean are you sure there is nothing you can say to help BNA become a better songwriter? Nothing at all you think is lacking? I know that I enjoy getting feedback and I usually incorporate it into my final product.

To quote me in "Songwriting for Beginners":

"A critique of "This sucks" is about as useful as one that says "this is perfect". Well, unless you really mean it. I haven't seen one yet. I haven't written one yet, the perfect one I mean. "

I'm not trying to be insulting, I'm just trying to give constructive criticism.

Maybe it's not a mutual appreciation society, but it IS a support group for would-be writers.......I for one try to downplay the negatives and highlight the positives in everyone's songs.......

Re - BNA's songs.......she has a unique style of writing, think Anne Rice / Stream of Consciousness / Gothic Poetry / Nico........I for one love it, and can't wait to see what she writes each week.......that standard of writing in a (16?) year old kid is f******g outstanding........as she gets older and adds experience to imagination, I think the results could be awesome.....

And I have noticed lately, the critics on this forum won't stand for anything less than one's best...........the standard of writing seems to improve by the week.........if people would only look at grammar etc....

I personally feel this forum has dragged some good writing out of me...made me change my songwriting point of view, I now try to put more imagery into my songs.........

And if it sucks, there are some honest people........take a bow, Cheap Thrill!!!....who aren't afraid to tell you it sucks.......but they will at least tell you how and why it sucks, and offer suggestions for improvements...........

Anyway, who said lyrics have to make sense? Nearly 40 years on, I'm still trying to make sense of "Sad-Eyed Lady Of The Lowlands"... :) :? 8)

Vic

I think positives and negatives are fine, but you shouldn't concentrate on just the positives. This forum is all about improving, you can't do that without knowing what it is you need to improve.

Support is fine, but this forum is about improving your own work. You need to be critiqued to do that.

and...I did not just say it sucked. I said it needed work and I offered suggestions on how to fix the problems I saw.

Hey, am I suddenly not allowed to give my two cents?

Support is fine, but this forum is about improving your own work. You need to be critiqued to do that.

No arguments there...but if you're going to dissect someone's work, there has to be a rational argument for or against their work.......

and...I did not just say it sucked. I said it needed work and I offered suggestions on how to fix the problems I saw.

None there, either...

Hey, am I suddenly not allowed to give my two cents?

Of course you are, as is anyone else.......your rules of songwriting have helped me a lot, but, at the end of the day *CLICHE ALERT* there are no rules.........only guidelines..........

Nick, I respect you as a songwriter, I respect you as a critic, I respect you as an "elder statesman" of this website, I respect you full stop.......but (And here's that *CLICHE ALERT* again) at the end of the day we are all different...........

And as Dylan said way back in 65..........

Come mothers and fathers, throughout the land,
And don't criticise what you can't understand.......

The times really are a changing, my friend!!!!

But do feel free to continue critiquing....maybe we do need a Simon Cowell figure in this forum......!!! Or should I call you Sharon?

:D :D :D

Vic

Wow, this is getting silly.

I think I did critique rationally.

There doesn't have to be an argument for or against anymore than I already gave. I just voiced my opinion. It doesn't have to be the same as yours.

..and I quote:

My opinion:

It doesn't make sense to me.
It doesn't really flow from beginning to end.
You do a lot of telling and not much showing.
Some of the words are forced.

How about this then:

"A man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest" Paul Simon

..and the times aren't a changin that much. A good song is still a good song and a bad one is still a bad one. This one happens to have a lot of potential, it just needs some work.

Can we get back to the song now?

Everyone, we need to get back to the song.

This isn't about me, so please stop critiquing my critique. There was never anything personal intended in my critique.

If I offended anyone by my abrupt appearance and sudden critiques, my sincere apologies. I can see how that would be very off-putting to some.

BNA I apologize to you for bringing this mess in here.

I just found myself with some extra time, and some very interesting entries this week and just invited myself back in. Probably a dumb thing to do unannounced.

I'll write one this week so you all can have fun critiquing me.

If you'd like to talk to me about this post, IM me. I'm not continuing this discussion in this thread.

And if it sucks, there are some honest people........take a bow, Cheap Thrill!!!....who aren't afraid to tell you it sucks.......but they will at least tell you how and why it sucks, and offer suggestions for improvements...........
*takes a bow* :D thanks vic. i am happy that i am able to stand out on this board, even if it isn't b/c of my song writting ability. :oops: i guess it is good if i can help someone else out, that is half the reason for us comming here and posting. we can't be selfish and not tell people what we really think about their work. it is nice to hear nice things about our work, but the negative things are what helps us to change and make out work better.

i do what i can around here.

-CheapThrill