i don't care, if it goes on forever, then thats okay, if it doesnt, thats okay too. as far as famous or infamous, thats up to you all. I mean, its just not 13 pages of just me...
"The Beauty of Music is my Sanity. Without it, I would simply lose my gravity, and blow away with the breeze." - Ness K(Aka Matt Harris)
No, it will never end.
oh by the way here is a great example of some sample based electronic music that is pushing the boundaries and using the technology at our disposal. This consists entirely of recordings of different balls bouncing off different surfacesa.
He has time extended, pitch shifted and torn to shreds the original sounds to create something incredible
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ytaeyWQCCw
OK, I listened to and watched this video. I guess it is creative, but I would not call it very musical. I guess tastes have just changed today. Kids today love Rap that is based mostly on rhythm and love electronic sounds like this video. That's ok, whatever floats your boat. But I expect more from from music than this. I certainly would not spend money to go hear electronic music like this, creative as it is.
Whether people like it or not, the only way to judge anyone's work is by other people's approval or disapproval. If your boss likes the work you do, you get a raise, if he (or she) doesn't, you get fired. And it is the same with music, the only way to judge music is by the number of records they sell, or the size of crowd they draw. Now, Rap groups draw large and enthusiatic crowds, so in that sense it is good music. It sells. But I think longevity is a more meaningful way to judge music.
There have always been fads. Back in the 80's the "Pet Rock" came out. Believe it or not, people rushed out to buy these painted ordinary rocks that came in a colorful little box with the rock's name. And of course, everybody remembers the "Tickle-Me Elmo" fad a few years back. But do these toys have any value?? Not much, they have been long forgotten. On the other hand, toys like Monopoly or Scrabble have continued to sell millions for decades, the Frisbee too. So they have more value.
And music is the same. When you continue to hear songs on the radio for 40 years or more, there is a reason. It is not a fad, fads come and go quickly. The music is still out there because people still enjoy it. I am amazed that Rap has lasted 20 years now. So I guess it has value, even though I don't see it myself. But I do not really hear stations playing early Rap music as you have radio stations that play 50's, 60's, 70's, or 80's music.
It doesn't really matter. If you enjoy a particular type of music, more power to you. I will never understand Rap's appeal or electronic music either, but that doesn't matter to anyone but myself either. :D
If you know something better than Rock and Roll, I'd like to hear it - Jerry Lee Lewis
excellent post, people like what they like. And btw, didnt the pet rock come out in the 70's
"The Beauty of Music is my Sanity. Without it, I would simply lose my gravity, and blow away with the breeze." - Ness K(Aka Matt Harris)
But I think longevity is a more meaningful way to judge music.
The real test is going to be how much of that music is still played when the boomers are all dead. Will it still be played in such quantity when those who grew up listening to it are gone? I think not. Some of it will but most of it probably not.
How much music of the 20's and 30's do you hear on mainstream radio? Very little. Is it because not only is all music after the late 50's, 60's, and parts of the 70's crap but all music before then is crap too? No, it's because the people who grew up listening to it are mostly dead. Sure, there are still a select group of fans of that music and they get their hour or two Sunday afternoon on the local independent station.
And music is the same. When you continue to hear songs on the radio for 40 years or more, there is a reason. It is not a fad, fads come and go quickly. The music is still out there because people still enjoy it. I am amazed that Rap has lasted 20 years now. So I guess it has value, even though I don't see it myself. But I do not really hear stations playing early Rap music as you have radio stations that play 50's, 60's, 70's, or 80's music.
As to what stations play what music now it comes down to demographics again. The boomers are a huge percentage of the population and the market caters to their tastes now as it has since they first made their appearance.
If you were putting a radio station together now which would you choose? A station targeted to the largest segment of the population which has the largest disposable income (think lots of advertising revenue) and fairly predictable listening tastes meaning little to no new music needs to be purchased and easy to program? Or would you choose to target a much smaller segment of the population which has a much smaller disposable income, has varied and constantly changing listening tastes, and may already have abandoned the medium you are using?
Stop swimming in that river.
Pop music is about stealing pocket money from children. - Ian Anderson
If you were putting a radio station together now which would you choose? A station targeted to the largest segment of the population which has the largest disposable income (think lots of advertising revenue) and fairly predictable listening tastes meaning little to no new music needs to be purchased and easy to program? Or would you choose to target a much smaller segment of the population which has a much smaller disposable income, has varied and constantly changing listening tastes, and may already have abandoned the medium you are using?
Stop swimming in that river.
This seems like a good argument on the surface except for one thing. Back in the 60's and 70's radio stations were playing music the young people liked, not what the older generation with "disposable income" listened to. Fact.
And really, it is the younger generation with disposable income. Older people tend to have greater responsibilities than young people. Young people are more apt to spend money on recordings and concerts than older people.
How many older adults own IPods??
And what does the "stop swimming in that river" comment mean??
If you know something better than Rock and Roll, I'd like to hear it - Jerry Lee Lewis
This seems like a good argument on the surface except for one thing. Back in the 60's and 70's radio stations were playing music the young people liked, not what the older generation with "disposable income" listened to. Fact.
And really, it is the younger generation with disposable income. Older people tend to have greater responsibilities than young people. Young people are more apt to spend money on recordings and concerts than older people.
There were a number of stations that played "young people" music at that time but they were targeting a very large audience. Remember that then as now the boomers made up the largest group of the population. It was a choice between older people with more money or the larger group and it seems that both group got targeted. Now, you can target both at the same time with a single format.
The oldies station I sometimes tune into in the car has lots of ads for the oldsters - lumber yards, mortgage refinancing (not so much of that recently), auto dealers, weight loss pills, vacation condos, etc. Lots of money to be made from those boomers in the peak of their earning years.
How many older adults own IPods??
Makes no difference to a discussion about radio other than that if you're listening to your iPod you're not listening to the radio. Younger people, who are more likely to own an iPod, are not listening to the radio and the music they're listening to is probably downloaded (whether legally or illegally is another discussion).
And what does the "stop swimming in that river" comment mean??
It's a reference to your earlier comment about the river in Egypt.
Pop music is about stealing pocket money from children. - Ian Anderson
Check out these articles
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003628343_classicrock21e.html
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080107195832AAmA06i
I like the 2nd article especially, because many of the young people who respond say exactly what I said, "the older music is BETTER than the modern stuff"
The first article reports that many young people today tune into Classic Rock stations. Nuff said. It also said:
Music-industry analyst Bob Lefsetz said classic rock is growing in popularity because teens are turned off by newer music.
That river in Egypt is still there.
If you know something better than Rock and Roll, I'd like to hear it - Jerry Lee Lewis
I think it's interesting that my college age kids and their friends (who listen to a lot of modern alt-rock, too) are more into "classic rock" than anything.
"A cheerful heart is good medicine."
I think it's interesting that my college age kids and their friends (who listen to a lot of modern alt-rock, too) are more into "classic rock" than anything.
Yeah, it's kinda like watching the news everyday and hearing how the whole world hates the U.S.A., yet people come here from all over the world in droves.
If you know something better than Rock and Roll, I'd like to hear it - Jerry Lee Lewis
I think it's interesting that my college age kids and their friends (who listen to a lot of modern alt-rock, too) are more into "classic rock" than anything.
Yeah, it's kinda like watching the news everyday and hearing how the whole world hates the U.S.A., yet people come here from all over the world in droves.
Hate the country, love the people ;)
Nah just kidding.
I used to know a few kids back in high school who listened nearly exclusively to classic rock, hell my partner is one of them, and she still does!!!
They're the kind of people to look on the net for articles about their fave old bands and post supportive, but statistically misleading comments about them. They've got good arguments too, they've been defending their old music all through their formative years.
truth is a lot of the best new music involves an effort to go out and hear it, unless its got doo doos and woah-oahs in it the labels wont touch or promote it. Due to the general apathy of young people, from the limited range of music they are exposed to, classic rock is the best. But I still strongly believe that there is stuff at least equal to or better than that out there being made today. It's just become harder to find.
Don't sweat it dude, just play!
well since I like a good debate I'll keep this going.
As far as classic rock being better I doubt it. Is there good music in it absolutely. Do some kids listen to classic rock absolutely. Do the majority of young people listen to classic rock over today's music...doubtful.
At the end of the day it's what you grew up with. I'm with Hyper on this. You won't hear what they call classic rock much ten years from now just like you don't hear much big band etc. Sure you'll catch the odd one off station that plays it but most will be playing the current music.
But radio is a business not a validation of how good the music is. Classic rock is playing now because there is a large portion of AMerican society that grew up with it and that's what they want to hear. That has nothing to do with the music being somehow BETTER than anything else. It's just a numbers game
Also kids growing up today have more choices of what to listen too then the baby boomers. All the baby boomers had is what we now call classic rock, there wasn't much rap or hip hop etc.
Ric - I think that's pretty much an exception.
If so many young people are into classic rock how come when I go to bars to see a classic rock band 95% of them are old people now? Why aren't the young people coming out in droves if there are so many of them that love this music. I was out last Friday and saw 2 classic rock bands playing and in both bars the average age was probably 45+, I had to leave it was making me feel old.
There's no way that anyone here is going to make me believe the majority of young people prefer calssic rock over all other types of music.
Classic rock was alittle more guitar oriented with almost every song having a solo. The music of the 90's started getting away from that which is a good thing. If we kept the same approach to music and just followed the same formula things would get really boring. As a guitar player I can see people having a interest in it tough.
The only real thing I have a problem with is labelling any of the music as better, because that's an opinion and not factual. All music has equal value and it takes talent to make any of it be it calssic rock or rap.
"It's all about stickin it to the man!"
It's a long way to the top if you want to rock n roll!
Interesting discussion. I will say this, while I can't offer this statement up with any real hard supporting facts, I do find that the playlist on the "Classic Rock" stations in our area have certainly changed over time. Whereas, in the past the music played consisted of what I would traditionally call classic rock (ie. late 60's, early 70's artists like Led Zeppelin, Hendrix, The Who, Janis Joplin, Cream, The Doors, etc.) I find those same stations now mixing in more bands that came of age in the 80's (like U2, Van Halen, etc.). I'm sure 20 years from now those same "Classic Rock" stations will be dominated by bands/artists from the 90's and today. Having said that, I do think there is a distinction to be made with respect to what radio stations define as classic rock (for marketing purposes) and what people in my age group (I'm 40) traditionally associate the term with. Hard to explain I suppose, but when I think of "classic rock", for me its part "era" but also part "music style" , but necessarily exclusive to either, if that makes any sense.
Chris, you didn't read the articles I posted. The number of young listeners tuning in to Classic Rock stations has grown dramatically in the last few years. A music exec said it is due to young people being frustrated with modern music.
You are right, it is a numbers game. But the reason so many stations are playing Classic Rock is because both older and younger listeners like it more.
Sorry, but that is the facts.
If you know something better than Rock and Roll, I'd like to hear it - Jerry Lee Lewis
The problem with classic rock is there is never any knew classic rock. I know this would seem obvious but you won't ever have a new Jimi Hendrix song. Some bands release new stuff but it's compared to their "classic" songs, doesn't measure up and is quickly forgotten. I'm sure everyone knows what I'm talking about, songs that everyone loves but are just sick of hearing. The songs will vary from one person to the next but Bohemian Rhapsody tops my list. Even song Nirvana songs I can get tired of because like Hendrix, we won't see a new Nirvana song.
Love them or hate them new bands have the advantage that they are, well, new. It's a lot harder to get tired of a band that's putting new songs out. That being said, you can always get people into the classics by re-arranging them. I would think that would be the way to get young people into the new stuff and even the older musicians into the newer stuff. I discovered Led Zeppelin's Kashmir by hearing Alter Bridge cover it (though I still prefer the cover).
Will classic rock out live it's fans? Yes, I believe it will. Will it last forever? No because nothing ever does.
With that, check out this modern spin on a classic Black Sabbath song.
"In what, twisted universe does mastering Eddie Van Halen's two handed arpeggio technique count as ABSOLUTELY NOTHING?!" - Dr Gregory House
I agree with your last post completely. As much as I like Classic Rock, CR stations seem to play a very limited selection of the great music of that time. There is a vast amount of fantastic Classic Rock that you rarely hear. That old hit by Mott the Hoople is a perfect example. Great song, but I don't think I've ever heard it on a Classic Rock station. And as far as Hendrix, there are dozens of great songs by Hendrix you never hear on the radio. So, it hasn't been exhausted at all.
But I agree, eventually even great songs get old. The problem is that the newer bands simply aren't putting out that many truly great songs. I listen to modern Rock, and I hear a few songs that are pretty awesome, but not many. And I think that is why the Radio stations have gone toward Classic Rock.
You can't just keep saying that these stations are playing this music because their audience is old. That has never been the case. Most radio listeners are young.
If you know something better than Rock and Roll, I'd like to hear it - Jerry Lee Lewis
